Defendant filed counter claim, are these things even allowed?

[Merricats]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Massachusetts

I filed in small claims against a company that is located in Minnesota. I did business with them for a few months, and while I was working with them, they created and provided me with an interactive map of my service area for my business. About two months after I fired them, they disabled the map without warning--hence the lawsuit. I feel they should have notified me of the termination of the map hosting to allow me to make other arrangements or should have provided me with a way to transfer the map to my own servers. They did not, and so customers visiting my website could not determine if I served their area.

Today I got papers in the mail from this company counterclaiming for travel to MA (airfare), lodging, food, transportation & parking while in MA, legal advice, and "preparation for this claim and counterclaim, based on our usual consulting fee of $100/hour for 40 hours of research, document prep, investigation of law, etc"

My questions are, can you even sue for travel and parking and lodging? Can you sue because you have to prep for a case? Can you sue for legal advice on a small claims case?

Thanks!

 

[Taxing Matters]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Massachusetts

My questions are, can you even sue for travel and parking and lodging? Can you sue because you have to prep for a case? Can you sue for legal advice on a small claims case?

Thanks!

You had a contract with this company. Take it out and read it. What does it say about including these kinds of costs in the judgment?

 

[Merricats]

You had a contract with this company. Take it out and read it. What does it say about including these kinds of costs in the judgment?

I did not have any kind of written contract with them (my bad, I know).

But, my contract with them is beside the point, no? THEY are countersuing ME for these things and I want to know if that is even allowed.

 

[FlyingRon]

Unless the contract provides for it or it's one of the few places in the statutes (unfair competition or business practices, frivoulous lawsuits), they will not prevail in getting legal fees or litigation expenses.
Of course, that doesn't stop them from trying. Absent reading their claim, we don't know if they have a valid claim or not or what their chance of prevailing is.

I've got my doubts about your case as well. Absent a contract, if you unilaterally terminated them, I'm not sure why they had any responsibility to provide you further services or notifications.

 

[Merricats]

Unless the contract provides for it

What contract??



I've got my doubts about your case as well. Absent a contract, if you unilaterally terminated them, I'm not sure why they had any responsibility to provide you further services or notifications.

Because it was a service I paid for. If someone created an entire website for me, that website is mine to use. If I fire them they don't get to disable my website. Or am I missing something?

 

[latigo]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Massachusetts

I filed in small claims against a company that is located in Minnesota. I did business with them for a few months, and while I was working with them, they created and provided me with an interactive map of my service area for my business. About two months after I fired them, they disabled the map without warning--hence the lawsuit. I feel they should have notified me of the termination of the map hosting to allow me to make other arrangements or should have provided me with a way to transfer the map to my own servers. They did not, and so customers visiting my website could not determine if I served their area.

Today I got papers in the mail from this company counterclaiming for travel to MA (airfare), lodging, food, transportation & parking while in MA, legal advice, and "preparation for this claim and counterclaim, based on our usual consulting fee of $100/hour for 40 hours of research, document prep, investigation of law, etc"

My questions are, can you even sue for travel and parking and lodging? Can you sue because you have to prep for a case? Can you sue for legal advice on a small claims case?

Thanks!

In order to provide a meaningful answers to your questions one would need to know the nature of the business relationship; what relief you are asking from court; the legal ground for you claim; and what in turn is the legal grounds for the counter claim.

Whether there is anything in your association with the counter claimant wherein it is spelled out that if a lawsuit should ensue between the parties over the subject matter of the association that the prevailing party is entitled to an award of attorney fees. A such fees are only allowed when provided by contract or statute.

Since the mentioned hourly rate of $100 wouldn't befitting a lawyer's time its presumed that they are seeking reimbursement at that rate for the time spent in preparing their response to your claim in chief. None of which would be compensatory by way of legal damages.

Nor would the counter claimant be entitled to claim as compensatory damages its out of pocket in traveling to Massachusetts for court appearances. Which I presume is meant by "airfare, lodging, food", etc.

Please understand that the above simply represents some observations, based upon very limited information, and not to be taken as legal advice. For that you need to consult with your Massachusetts attorney. But I will leave you with one thought. And that is never to sell you opponent short. Lawyers that make the mistake of rely on the weakness of the opposition's case instead of the strength of their own commonly end up seeking honest employment.

 

[quincy]

Unless the contract provides for it

What contract??



I've got my doubts about your case as well. Absent a contract, if you unilaterally terminated them, I'm not sure why they had any responsibility to provide you further services or notifications.

Because it was a service I paid for. If someone created an entire website for me, that website is mine to use. If I fire them they don't get to disable my website. Or am I missing something?

If the interactive map was created for your use with an agreement (written or oral) to pay on a month-to-month basis, and you decide to terminate the agreement and not pay for the map, the creator of the interactive map is entitled to disable it and prevent your future use.

It really gets down to what the terms of your agreement were and, in the case of an oral agreement, how you and the other party remember these terms (and who can best prove the terms).

Is the other party countersuing for more than the small claims limit?

 

[Merricats]

If the interactive map was created for your use with an agreement (written or oral) to pay on a month-to-month basis, and you decide to terminate the agreement and not pay for the map, the creator of the interactive map is entitled to disable it and prevent your future use.

It really gets down to what the terms of your agreement were and, in the case of an oral agreement, how you and the other party remember these terms (and who can best prove the terms).

Like I said there was no real contract. All I have is the email where they said I could use the map feature:

Good morning!

I got the first draft of your region and fee map and I've attached it here. I mentioned yesterday that you might notice minor differences by changing from miles to zip codes, but the general areas will be about the same. Take a look at this map and let me know if you see any changes that need to be made and I'll send that back to the map designer for revision.

The attached map is just a draft as a PDF, so it's static and not interactive. Once he gets your final approval, then he will create the interactive map like you saw on the MN Pets website and that's the one we'll use internally here and I'll also send you the embedding information so that you can put it on your website for your clients if you'd like.

I have a spreadsheet of the corresponding zipcodes, so if you make changes, he'll change that list for us so that it all matches up.

There is no mention of it being month to month or contingent on anything at all. And what I said in my claim was not that I expected them to continue to host the map indefinitely, but that my complaint is that I was given no notice of the termination.

 

[Just Blue]

Like I said there was no real contract. All I have is the email where they said I could use the map feature:

Good morning!

I got the first draft of your region and fee map and I've attached it here. I mentioned yesterday that you might notice minor differences by changing from miles to zip codes, but the general areas will be about the same. Take a look at this map and let me know if you see any changes that need to be made and I'll send that back to the map designer for revision.

The attached map is just a draft as a PDF, so it's static and not interactive. Once he gets your final approval, then he will create the interactive map like you saw on the MN Pets website and that's the one we'll use internally here and I'll also send you the embedding information so that you can put it on your website for your clients if you'd like.

I have a spreadsheet of the corresponding zipcodes, so if you make changes, he'll change that list for us so that it all matches up.

There is no mention of it being month to month or contingent on anything at all. And what I said in my claim was not that I expected them to continue to host the map indefinitely, but that my complaint is that I was given no notice of the termination.

How much notice did you give before firing them?

 

[quincy]

Like I said there was no real contract. All I have is the email where they said I could use the map feature:

Good morning!

I got the first draft of your region and fee map and I've attached it here. I mentioned yesterday that you might notice minor differences by changing from miles to zip codes, but the general areas will be about the same. Take a look at this map and let me know if you see any changes that need to be made and I'll send that back to the map designer for revision.

The attached map is just a draft as a PDF, so it's static and not interactive. Once he gets your final approval, then he will create the interactive map like you saw on the MN Pets website and that's the one we'll use internally here and I'll also send you the embedding information so that you can put it on your website for your clients if you'd like.

I have a spreadsheet of the corresponding zipcodes, so if you make changes, he'll change that list for us so that it all matches up.

There is no mention of it being month to month or contingent on anything at all. And what I said in my claim was not that I expected them to continue to host the map indefinitely, but that my complaint is that I was given no notice of the termination.

For what did you pay the company? You keep mentioning "service" which indicates an ongoing relationship.

What are you asking for in your claim?

What besides attorney fees and costs is the company asking for in their counterclaim?

 

[Zigner]

Like I said there was no real contract. All I have is the email where they said I could use the map feature:

It's CLEAR that you would "use" (your word) the map, not "own" it.

...my complaint is that I was given no notice of the termination.

Huh???
You "fired" them, and then continued to "use" what they provided for two months. Sounds to me like you got at least one month, if not two months, more use of the service than you should have.

 

[quincy]

I am still not clear for what Merricats is suing? A refund of money paid to the company for the interactive map?

 

[Zigner]

I am still not clear for what Merricats is suing? A refund of money paid to the company for the interactive map?

...yeah, for the two months that he didn't even pay for it.

If the other party were smart, they'd move to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction.

 

[latigo]

. . . . If the other party were smart, they'd move to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction.

It would be a little late for now.

 

[quincy]

...yeah, for the two months that he didn't even pay for it.

If the other party were smart, they'd move to dismiss for lack of jurisdiction.

Jurisdiction can get tricky when a business is internet-based so I guess I am not as puzzled by that as I am about what exactly is being sought in the claim and counterclaim.

And not having a written contract to refer to is bound to confuse the court, as well.

Merricats would no doubt benefit from a Massachusetts attorney's assistance - especially if the company in Minnesota has an attorney - but with the small claims limit as it is, it might not make financial sense.