Denied Unemployment Benefits Appeal Hearing

[JGC2080]

I was discharged for doing donuts on my forklift while on a safety warning. I admitted to this and signed a statement. My unemployment benefits were denied, I appealed, and a hearing is scheduled. Do I have a case to be made for obtaining unemployment benefits or should withdraw my appeal? I could argue that under a moment of great stress I was unable to judge properly.

 

[Zigner]

I was discharged for doing donuts on my forklift while on a safety warning. I admitted to this and signed a statement. My unemployment benefits were denied, I appealed, and a hearing is scheduled. Do I have a case to be made for obtaining unemployment benefits or should withdraw my appeal? I could argue that under a moment of great stress I was unable to judge properly.

You have not given us your state, but generally, there is no downside to appealing. Furthermore, we can't tell you definitively if you "have a case." I will say this, however: If one of my employees did what you say you did, I would put up a most vigorous defense towards any claim for unemployment compensation.

 

[JGC2080]

You have not given us your state, but generally, there is no downside to appealing. Furthermore, we can't tell you definitively if you "have a case." I will say this, however: If one of my employees did what you say you did, I would put up a most vigorous defense towards any claim for unemployment compensation.

Massachusetts. Everyone has told me to appeal but having to make my case for unemployment benefits face to face is intimidating. The law states willful misconduct or violation of accepted rule disqualifies someone from unemployment. If you were in my shoes what would you say?

 

[Zigner]

Massachusetts. Everyone has told me to appeal but having to make my case for unemployment benefits face to face is intimidating. The law states willful misconduct or violation of accepted rule disqualifies someone from unemployment. If you were in my shoes what would you say?

I'm not in your shoes, nor would I ever be.

 

[Proserpina]

Massachusetts. Everyone has told me to appeal but having to make my case for unemployment benefits face to face is intimidating. The law states willful misconduct or violation of accepted rule disqualifies someone from unemployment. If you were in my shoes what would you say?

Just to clarify - you were already "on a warning" and you were messing around during or after that warning? Not before?

 

[Zigner]

Just to clarify - you were already "on a warning" and you were messing around during or after that warning? Not before?

Frankly, before or after the warning isn't very relevant...every trained forklift operator (and even those who are not trained) knows not to do donuts with the forklift.

 

[JGC2080]

Just to clarify - you were already "on a warning" and you were messing around during or after that warning? Not before?

I was already on a final warning for safety before I misused my forklift. I know I sound like a idiot. I know can't defend any of my mistakes. I just want to hear whether people think I should withdraw my appeal or not. If there is any chance I could get any unemployment then it's worth going through it.

 

[Zigner]

I was already on a final warning for safety before I misused my forklift. I know I sound like a idiot. I know can't defend any of my mistakes. I just want to hear whether people think I should withdraw my appeal or not. If there is any chance I could get any unemployment then it's worth going through it.

Are you for real?

Again, there is no downside to the appeal. Based on what you've posted, I don't think you have a snowball's chance in hades of actually prevailing, but it doesn't hurt to try.

 

[Proserpina]

Frankly, before or after the warning isn't very relevant...every trained forklift operator (and even those who are not trained) knows not to do donuts with the forklift.

Yeah, I know. I needed confirmation though. Just to make sure I wasn't seeing things.

 

[JGC2080]

Are you for real?

Again, there is no downside to the appeal. Based on what you've posted, I don't think you have a snowball's chance in hades of actually prevailing, but it doesn't hurt to try.

Thank you all for responding.

 

[commentator]

Sure, there's no downside to appealing the denial of benefits. But then again, I wouldn't have serious hopes of winning, because I frankly can't quite see a positive way of spinning what you did. In order to keep you from drawing unemployment benefits, the employer has to show, and because they fired you, the burden of proof is on them to do it, that you were terminated for a valid, misconduct reason. That you were aware of what the rules were, had received training and then prior warnings related to your inappropriate conduct, and that you had willfully disregarded those warnings and chosen to do something that you were pretty sure was going to get you fired.

Okay, how could we spin this to make it seem like cutting donuts with the forklift was a good idea, or a defensible thing to do? Were you on the work floor when you were doing this? During work hours? Around material and machinery and other workers? Was there a general rule forbidding "horseplay" with the machinery? Had you received safety training on the forklift? Were your other warnings related specifically to misuse of the forklift, or were they for things like not wearing your hearing protection or disregarding a policy of some other type? Your possible argument of "under a moment of great stress I was unable to judge properly" certainly could use more development. You were under a moment of great stress (as in you were being rushed, your forklift was about to crash into something, you had just worked fifteen hours without a break?) and were unable to judge properly. Judge what? Whether you were about to cut a donut, whether it would be a good idea to goof off, or maybe how hard you had turned the forklift, causing an involuntary donut?

All in all, there's no point in cancelling the hearing, they're not going to do anything but go through the process. But you have nothing to lose but a few minutes of your time. If you can think of any way why you could explain what you did so that it doesn't sound like you voluntarily and with full knowledge that it was a bad thing to do, chose to do something that would probably cause you to get fired (if you were caught doing it) then you may have a chance to prevail.

Don't feel bad, though, people have done some really crazy dumb things to get fired (like the guy who set the building on fire so he could leave work early.) But like I say, there's no downside to going through it.

 

[cbg]

I am in MA and have a lot of experience with the DUA.

There is no downside to going through with the appeal. If you do appeal, it's barely possible that the ALJ will have gone quietly insane that morning and will grant benefits; if you don't appeal you definitely won't get them.

However, you don't really have any grounds to fight the denial other than that it is your right to do so, and the odds of your prevailing are low enough that I don't really have enough math skills to calculate them.