Help with songs & lyrics ownership

[drewbagel423]

This is in New Jersey

Not sure if this is the correct section to post this in. Mods feel free to move it if it isn't.

My wife is a singer/songwriter and is in the process of creating a children's album. She doesn't play any instruments, and can't write music for them. So we've started posting ads in search of band members (pianists, guitarists, etc). When the time comes to eventually start selling albums, are these folks entitled to royalties, or can we just pay them a flat fee/hourly pay for their time. I've heard conflicting answers because technically they will be involved in the music creation process.

Also, what is the best way (if there is one) for my wife to claim ownership of the lyrics and songs she currently has? We want to avoid any possible IP disputes down the road if we can.

I'm not even sure if I'm asking the right questions, but we just want to get a basic understanding of how these things work before we get too far along. We appreciate any help you can give us.

 

[Sloop John D]

You can gain full control of the songs in a couple different ways, but because of the complexities involved, it would be highly advisable to hire an attorney.

 

[FlyingRon]

There are two things she must do. First she must establish copyright in her own. Performance is NOT sufficient.
I would recommend she write down the lyrics and somehow record the tune (she can record herself singing it) or perhaps use one of the notation programs.

When she needs to bring in musicians to help, the best bet would be to have them execute a work for hire agreement before getting started where they acknowledge in exchange for whatever you are paying them (flat fee or hourly) that all rights to the modified work remains with her.

 

[drewbagel423]

Thanks for the responses... in both forums.

 

[Lisho]

I agree to Sloop John. It may be recommended to consult an attorney in this case. In the end that way you can save a lot of money.

 

[quincy]

This is in New Jersey

Not sure if this is the correct section to post this in. Mods feel free to move it if it isn't.

My wife is a singer/songwriter and is in the process of creating a children's album. She doesn't play any instruments, and can't write music for them. So we've started posting ads in search of band members (pianists, guitarists, etc). When the time comes to eventually start selling albums, are these folks entitled to royalties, or can we just pay them a flat fee/hourly pay for their time. I've heard conflicting answers because technically they will be involved in the music creation process.

Also, what is the best way (if there is one) for my wife to claim ownership of the lyrics and songs she currently has? We want to avoid any possible IP disputes down the road if we can.

I'm not even sure if I'm asking the right questions, but we just want to get a basic understanding of how these things work before we get too far along. We appreciate any help you can give us.

The advice you have received so far is excellent.

Finding an attorney in your area to help in creating a work for hire agreement can be important, so that your wife can ensure the agreement is one that can withstand legal challenge. What can be negotiable at the beginning and added to the agreement prior to all parties signing is the agreed upon flat rate or hourly rate of pay.

What FlyingRon mentioned about writing down the lyrics and recording vocals can be important - and your wife should then register both the lyrics and sound recording with the Copyright Office. The registration of these will provide your wife with the presumption of ownership in the works. The presumption of ownership can help your wife defeat any ownership challenges should there be a legal dispute with the musicians later.

Again, seeking out the advice and direction of an attorney in your area (a lawyer experienced in entertainment law may suit your purposes best) is wise and strongly advised. Good luck.

 

[tinaseals]

Work For Hire

What you desire is a Work For Hire Agreement that negotiates a flat rate be paid for all services rendered, and the relinquishing of all rights to ownership and or royalties.

You might get a fight, the more established the artist/ musician.

Also maybe seek talent from a temp agency who specializes in connecting project based tablet to clients.

 

[tinaseals]

Work For Hire

What you desire is a Work For Hire Agreement that negotiates a flat rate be paid for all services rendered, and the relinquishing of all rights to ownership and or royalties.

You might get a fight, the more established the artist/ musician.

Also maybe seek talent from a temp agency who specializes in: connecting project based talent to clients.

 

[quincy]

What you desire is a Work For Hire Agreement that negotiates a flat rate be paid for all services rendered, and the relinquishing of all rights to ownership and or royalties.

You might get a fight, the more established the artist/ musician.

Also maybe seek talent from a temp agency who specializes in: connecting project based talent to clients.

I wasn't going to get into this, because drewbagel's wife will need to sit down with an attorney in New Jersey to review all facts anyway but, because the Work for Hire Agreement has been mentioned a few times now (twice by tinaseals, thanks to her double posting ), I probably should provide some additional information.

Whether what drewbagel and drewbagel's wife "desire" is a work for hire agreement or not will be best determined by an attorney in New Jersey who can review all facts and advise them accordingly.

A work for hire agreement can cover works created by an employee within the scope of the employee's employment, or a work for hire agreement can cover certain commissioned works. If no employment relationship exists (and there are 11 factors to consider in deciding whether one exists or not), then a work could be a work for hire if a written work for hire agreement is signed by both parties AND the work falls within one of the Copyright Act's work for hire categories.

There are nine categories of works (see 17 USC Section 101) under which a commissioned work must fall in order for a work for hire agreement to be valid. If a work does not fall within one of the enumerated work for hire categories (and there is a chance under the described situation here, it wouldn't), then there would have to be an assignment of the copyrights.

If an assignment is necessary, the one who was commissioned to create the work would need to assign his copyrights in the created work to the one who commissioned the work, in order for the one who commissioned the work to acquire ownership.

It could be determined, after a review of the facts, that a collaboration agreement will work better for drewbagel's wife than a work for hire agreement. With a collaboration agreement, there can also be negotiated rights and payments.

But, without any written and signed agreement of any kind, then a court will presume that all who created the work together will share equally in the resulting work.

tinaseal's temp agency suggestion is one worth exploring when looking for talent.



(From what state, tinaseals, are you anticipating getting your law degree?)

 

[Fortion]

Your case is complicated consult a lawyer. He can help you good..

 

[Silverplum]

Please stop dredging up old threads to add meaningless tripe.

Your case is complicated consult a lawyer. He can help you good..