Inexplicable fainting & driving @ 82

[rowz]

Greetings from the North Jersey Shore.

My 82 yr. old Mom fainted recently on 2 occasions.
One while in a bank, she fainted twice [about10 minutes apart] and "did not recall" doing so. She refused First aid care and a ride to the hospital.

An appt.w/ her primary care doctoor was made. In the days before the appt., she admiited that she fainted a week or so prior, while gardening.

I told her not to drive until after the dr. cleared her to & brought her car to my house.

The dr. checked her out and ordered a some blood tests. The tests came back abobut 10 days later, clear, but he extended the driving prohibition pending the results of a heart monitor test.

She was PO'd at him,& me saying she was fine. I stood firm, kept her away from the car.

She attempted to "game' the 24 test by sitting in her recliner for the entoore period. The heart physician was informed of this by me when the device was returned.

Her primary Dr. evaluated the test and extended the no driving for a month and then "we shall see".

She was really haranging me about the car wanting to be brought back to her house and I was threatened with arrest, disinheritance, etc., etc.

I then realized that without anything in writing I could have a problem so I called Dr.'s office & asked for a note.
I got one the same day and without my asking they extended the no driving rule until November.

My sister and her husband are visiting for the long weekend and want me to let her have the car just "so she can wash it and know that its there....whats the harm". then they go home 5 hours away.

They have stated today that they want to take her car back to her tomorrow.
I do not agree.

The pressure is getting to me.

Though my wife & I have been taking her where she needs to go, she is really resentful about the situation and has now a couple of friends taking turns taking her.

I have become upset as one of these people is a 50 year old woman [a very nice lady] who has recently been diagnosed with narcolepsy. Mom has said its nothig to worry about that she knows when it is happening and can pull over. ;-/

Sadly, I do not trust my Mom to not drive between now & November. Any suggestions?

Thanks for your input.

RowZ

 

[Just Blue]

Greetings from the North Jersey Shore.

My 82 yr. old Mom fainted recently on 2 occasions.
One while in a bank, she fainted twice [about10 minutes apart] and "did not recall" doing so. She refused First aid care and a ride to the hospital.

An appt.w/ her primary care doctoor was made. In the days before the appt., she admiited that she fainted a week or so prior, while gardening.

I told her not to drive until after the dr. cleared her to & brought her car to my house.

The dr. checked her out and ordered a some blood tests. The tests came back abobut 10 days later, clear, but he extended the driving prohibition pending the results of a heart monitor test.

She was PO'd at him,& me saying she was fine. I stood firm, kept her away from the car.

She attempted to "game' the 24 test by sitting in her recliner for the entoore period. The heart physician was informed of this by me when the device was returned.

Her primary Dr. evaluated the test and extended the no driving for a month and then "we shall see".

She was really haranging me about the car wanting to be brought back to her house and I was threatened with arrest, disinheritance, etc., etc.

I then realized that without anything in writing I could have a problem so I called Dr.'s office & asked for a note.
I got one the same day and without my asking they extended the no driving rule until November.

My sister and her husband are visiting for the long weekend and want me to let her have the car just "so she can wash it and know that its there....whats the harm". then they go home 5 hours away.

They have stated today that they want to take her car back to her tomorrow.
I do not agree.

The pressure is getting to me.

Though my wife & I have been taking her where she needs to go, she is really resentful about the situation and has now a couple of friends taking turns taking her.

I have become upset as one of these people is a 50 year old woman [a very nice lady] who has recently been diagnosed with narcolepsy. Mom has said its nothig to worry about that she knows when it is happening and can pull over. ;-/

Sadly, I do not trust my Mom to not drive between now & November. Any suggestions?

Thanks for your input.

RowZ

You actually have no right to withhold another's property, even for such a valid reason. I would suggest you talk to an attorney to seek a legal way to solve this issue. Frankly this situation sounds like Mom is not fit to make her own decisions.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

Most states have a process whereby a driver can be reported for loss of driving ability. They usually require the person to retest and prove their ability to drive. With your report and the doctors opinion, this might be worth investigating.

Take the car to a local mechanic. Consider what types of mechanical malfunction might vex an impromptu trip, while maintaining discretion. Explaining the circumstances, ask the mechanic to pinpoint some simple malfunctions, that would render that model car non moveable or unable to start. Hope one of those things don't malfunction after you return the car.

 

[Just Blue]

Most states have a process whereby a driver can be reported for loss of driving ability. They usually require the person to retest and prove their ability to drive. With your report and the doctors opinion, this might be worth investigating.

Take the car to a local mechanic. Consider what types of mechanical malfunction might vex an impromptu trip, while maintaining discretion. Explaining the circumstances, ask the mechanic to pinpoint some simple malfunctions, that would render that model car non moveable or unable to start. Hope one of those things don't malfunction after you return the car.:D

Are you advising this person to commit a crime?

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

I only advised the OP to look into having the state review her ability to drive. I also suggested OP familiarize himself with things that might render the car inoperable. If they occur, OP will be able to go fix them, so mom will be able to drive her car again when the doctor gives permission. A good son would always make sure his mother has the ability to use her car, until she is found to be medically unqualified.

I have solved this problem with my mother. I am the lien holder on her car. She is required to make a car payment every Christmas, according to our contract. She is already in default on 2 payments. As soon as the eye doctor fails her on an eye exam (she has macular degeneration). I am going to repo the car for non payment.

 

[Proserpina]

I only advised the OP to look into having the state review her ability to drive. I also suggested OP familiarize himself with things that might render the car inoperable. If they occur, OP will be able to go fix them, so mom will be able to drive her car again when the doctor gives permission. A good son would always make sure his mother has the ability to use her car, until she is found to be medically unqualified.

I have solved this problem with my mother. I am the lien holder on her car. She is required to make a car payment every Christmas, according to our contract. She is already in default on 2 payments. As soon as the eye doctor fails her on an eye exam (she has macular degeneration). I am going to repo the car for non payment.

OH, you're very close to crossing the line in what you said earlier. IF it was merely misswording your post, that's fair enough.

But be careful. Because Blue wasn't the only one who read your post as HEAVILY suggestive of nefarious activity.

Now that aside.

OP, what you describe - about your relative "gaming" the heart monitor - isn't really how those things work.

Heart murmurs don't just happen when someone is up and active; they can happen at rest, while you're asleep, you name it. It's not easy to hide or produce a murmur like that.

I second Blue's suggestion; speak to an attorney about getting your relative fully assessed. There may be an issue with competency, but then again, the fainting could be completely idiopathic and she could be absolutely fine.

 

[OHRoadwarrior]

After rereading my post, I can see how you could interpret it that way. A friend of mine actually did finally do that to his senile father. He removed a battery cable from the car completely. Knowingly disabling your mothers car, could be considered criminal mischief, I would think OP. I would not suggest you ever do something like that.

OH, you're very close to crossing the line in what you said earlier. IF it was merely misswording your post, that's fair enough.

But be careful. Because Blue wasn't the only one who read your post as HEAVILY suggestive of nefarious activity.

Now that aside.

OP, what you describe - about your relative "gaming" the heart monitor - isn't really how those things work.

Heart murmurs don't just happen when someone is up and active; they can happen at rest, while you're asleep, you name it. It's not easy to hide or produce a murmur like that.

I second Blue's suggestion; speak to an attorney about getting your relative fully assessed. There may be an issue with competency, but then again, the fainting could be completely idiopathic and she could be absolutely fine.

 

[gam]

A heart monitor is not just used to detect heart murmurs. Heart murmurs can be detected with just a stethoscope. A heart monitor is used to monitor heart activity over a period of time. While you wear the monitor you must write down everything you do in a journal, which is turned in with the monitor. So it will matter if op's mom is just sitting in a chair. Doubtful op's mom is fainting while kicked back in her lounging chair. It's really important to do a monitor and do it correctly with unknown fainting.

There are other heart related tests the dr should also do on your mom. If they don't find anything heart related, she should then have a full work up with a neurologist.

I've had 3 family members who have had fainting issues in the last couple of years. But I don't live in your state, so what they were told on driving would most likely not be the same. Talk to the dr and see what you can do to prevent her from driving legally. She is not only putting herself in danger but others as well. Have you tried telling her that? Worked on my son when he was a teen and passing out, he didn't care till he realized he could harm others while driving.

 

[Proserpina]

A heart monitor is not just used to detect heart murmurs. Heart murmurs can be detected with just a stethoscope. A heart monitor is used to monitor heart activity over a period of time. While you wear the monitor you must write down everything you do in a journal, which is turned in with the monitor. So it will matter if op's mom is just sitting in a chair. Doubtful op's mom is fainting while kicked back in her lounging chair. It's really important to do a monitor and do it correctly with unknown fainting.

There are other heart related tests the dr should also do on your mom. If they don't find anything heart related, she should then have a full work up with a neurologist.

I've had 3 family members who have had fainting issues in the last couple of years. But I don't live in your state, so what they were told on driving would most likely not be the same. Talk to the dr and see what you can do to prevent her from driving legally. She is not only putting herself in danger but others as well. Have you tried telling her that? Worked on my son when he was a teen and passing out, he didn't care till he realized he could harm others while driving.

Huh.

I've been subjected to Holter monitoring regularly for several years now, for periods as short as 24 hours to as long as 30 days.

Not once was I instructed to use a journal. Heart activity was submitted telephonically.

 

[rowz]

Many thanks for the thoughtfully considered replies.

I took the thoughts about disabling in the spirit that they were given, so there is no fear there.

There is a family history of Mom's Dad having equilibrium issues in his last years.

Re: the heart monitor, there were no instructions about keepiong any kind of a journal.

One thought I did have was to contact the auto ins. company and CC with a copy of the Dr.'s letter. IMO that would result in them pulling her insurance and perhaps, her being put on an industry llist [?] that would result in her not being able to obtain insurance.

Also when I spoke to NJ DMV, I could send the info to the State who could suspend the driving license and make it necessary for a full blown re-test.

Non of these options will improve my relationship and only cause me more grief/aajeda. I'm getting worn down.
On an estate planning/protection note Moms pid off house [500K] would be a too attractive tarrget if she hurts/kills someone on the road.

My out-of-state Sis holds a [I think] general POA and is resistant to use it.
What I have read here over a long time is that such an out of state situation is not the best.

Its become a situation where she really seems to only being concerned with what she wants, not what is best and a responsible decision.

Thanks very much for the input from the respondents and for the site that has been made available.

RowZ

 

[gam]

Huh.

I've been subjected to Holter monitoring regularly for several years now, for periods as short as 24 hours to as long as 30 days.

Not once was I instructed to use a journal. Heart activity was submitted telephonically.

I've wore one to, and didn't have to keep a journal, but I was not fainting either. My son, husband and mom were, and all 3 had to keep a journal with theirs. They were also done telephonically, but the monitor was turned into the cardiologist office along with the journal. I don't know perhaps it is a fainting thing or a my area thing.

But that was not my point anyways. My point was OP does have a reason for concern, that her mom is just going to sit on her butt all day while wearing the monitor. Your suppose to go about your normal routine, if her mom's normal routine is sitting in her lounger for 24 hours or however long they want her to wear it, then it would be fine. But your heart and issues with it, work differently at rest then during activity and that is the point to wearing a monitor for 24 hours or longer, to monitor your heart activity over everything you do.

I understand that OP's questions were on mom driving, however OP needs to make sure mom is tested properly. The issue that is the biggest concern here is WHY IS MOM FAINTING. Some reasons for fainting are very serious and need to be treated. Not to mention the fact you can seriously injure yourself in the process of fainting. It can be costly to, as often an ambulance is called and a trip to the ER occurs. Concussions and broken bones can happen very easy when fainting.

If they can determine a reason for mom fainting and correct it, then mom would not have to worry about not driving. If mom gets into an accident, and someone decides to sue mom, they will look into her medical records. These fainting spells will be there.

 

[Zigner]

Non of these options will improve my relationship and only cause me more grief/aajeda. I'm getting worn down.

When your mother cared for you as a child, she likely had to do things that didn't make you very happy with her. Now, you are in the same position. You have to decide if your relationship with your mother is more important than her safety.

 

[LdiJ]

When your mother cared for you as a child, she likely had to do things that didn't make you very happy with her. Now, you are in the same position. You have to decide if your relationship with your mother is more important than her safety.

I agree, but its a tough situation because the legalities matter as well, particularly if other siblings are not on board with the OP's decisions.

We had a really tough time with the issue with my dad, when he was in the early stages of alzheimers.

If mom is competent to manage her own affairs and live alone, then its really questionable, legally, for one of her children to withhold her property, even if the doctor recommends no driving. Its less of an issue when all the siblings are on board.