parental rights

[rmcnellis]

What is the name of your state? montana
the situation: a child's father has full custody of her because the mother signed over her parental rights and the mother does not attempt to come and visit the child at home, call her, etc. the custody agreement says the mother gets "reasonable visitation." what does that mean? the mother has been nothing but disruptive and unstable for the child, being unable to provide clothing for her child or get her to school (she is 2 years behind because mom wouldn't get out of bed in the am to take her)when she did have custody, mom's kids were taken away several times by welfare while she was investigated and now mom doesn't call, doesn't write, doesn't come to the father's house to pick the child up or visit with her - instead she goes to the child's school and pulls her out of class to visit or she approaches her on the playground during recess. what can be done about the mother disrupting this child's life further? is it ok for a mother who has signed away her parental rights to pull a child out of school (she's not even listed as a relative on the child's record) and to approach her during recess? thanks in advance for any help.

 

[Boxcarbill]

a child's father has full custody of her because the mother signed over her parental rights and the mother does not attempt to come and visit the child at home, call her, etc. the custody agreement says the mother gets "reasonable visitation." what does that mean? > . . .is it ok for a mother who has signed away her parental rights to pull a child out of school (she's not even listed as a relative on the child's record) and to approach her during recess? thanks in advance for any help.

So has the mother's parental rights been terminated or not? Termination of parental rights terminates the parent/child relationship. That means no visitation, no child support, no custody issues. The relationship has been terminated.

Custody or possession/visitation matters are very different from termination of parental rights.

 

[VeronicaGia]

BoxcarBill, your comment is incorrect

You said: "Termination of parental rights terminates the parent/child relationship. That means no visitation, no child support, no custody issues. The relationship has been terminated. "

Terminating parental RIGHTS means terminating a parents rights to see the child, have access to school records, medical records, etc. It does not terminate the OBLIGATION a parent has to financially support his or her child unless someone (such as a new spouse) adopts the child.

Rights and obligations are two different things. Terminating a parents rights to a child does not terminate the parents obligation to pay support. So, if the parents rights in this case are terminated by order of the court, the parent cannot by law remove the child from school or anywhere else.

 

[Boxcarbill]

Re: BoxcarBill, your comment is incorrect

You said: "Termination of parental rights terminates the parent/child relationship. That means no visitation, no child support, no custody issues. The relationship has been terminated. "

Terminating parental RIGHTS means terminating a parents rights to see the child, have access to school records, medical records, etc. It does not terminate the OBLIGATION a parent has to financially support his or her child unless someone (such as a new spouse) adopts the child.

Rights and obligations are two different things. Terminating a parents rights to a child does not terminate the parents obligation to pay support. So, if the parents rights in this case are terminated by order of the court, the parent cannot by law remove the child from school or anywhere else.

Rights and obligations are separate things. However, an order which grants the Termination of Parental Rights, whether the termination is voluntary or involuntary terminate the parent/child relationship--including child support. (In some states, however, the child may be able to inherit by and through the parent whose rights have been terminated unless the court order specifically states that the right for the child to inherit is also terminated.)

 

[Boxcarbill]

Let me clarify that termination of child support. It terminates the obligation for future support. [ Past due child support may have been owed and those arrears may have been reduced to a money judgment]

 

[I AM ALWAYS LIABLE]

Re: BoxcarBill, your comment is incorrect

You said: "Termination of parental rights terminates the parent/child relationship. That means no visitation, no child support, no custody issues. The relationship has been terminated. "

Terminating parental RIGHTS means terminating a parents rights to see the child, have access to school records, medical records, etc. It does not terminate the OBLIGATION a parent has to financially support his or her child unless someone (such as a new spouse) adopts the child.

Rights and obligations are two different things. Terminating a parents rights to a child does not terminate the parents obligation to pay support. So, if the parents rights in this case are terminated by order of the court, the parent cannot by law remove the child from school or anywhere else.

Dear Veronica:

Insofar as California is concerned, member "BoxCarBill" is correct.
There has been new case law on the subject, and now, an order terminating parental rights (whether or not an adoption or other permanent placement plan has been adjudicated) completely severs the parent-child relationship, extinguishing the affected parent's child support obligation and divesting the court of authority to make a child support award against that parent. [Ca Fam § 7803; County of Ventura v. Gonzales (2001) 88 Cal.App.4th 1120, 1123-1124, 106 Cal.Rptr.2d 461, 464 (Ca Wel & Inst § 366.26 termination of father's parental rights); see also Fraizer v. Velkura (2001) 91 Cal.App.4th 942, 946, 110 Cal.Rptr.2d 918, 921]

IAAL

 

[Grace_Adler]

Thank you guys for clarifying and confirming that. I thought I read somewhere that terminating parental rights sometimes terminates child support.

That's just like some people think child support automatically goes back to the date of filing and that's not always the case. Although it is possible, it's not always automatic. Sometimes you have to ask for it or it won't be granted and it's also up to the judge.

 

[rmcnellis]

thanks for all the replies. just let me make sure i have this right . . . if the parent's rights HAVE been terminated, does that mean she has no more business than a stranger going into the child's school or approaching her during recess? could the child's father get a restraining order against her or take some kind of legal action to keep the mother away from the child in such a case? the problem is that, mom sneaks around behind dad and the rest of the family's back to see the child and tells the child not to say anything because she (the little girl) will get into trouble. it's like mom's saying: go ahead and sneak and lie - mom says it's ok. we (the family on dad's side) feel if mom could be a positive influence instead, we would have no problem with her seeing the child. we thought about writing her a letter stating that if she keeps up these sneaky visits, we will seek legal action to keep her from doing so, or we will seek child support. but if her parental rights HAVE been terminated, that means we cannot seek child support? thanks for all your help.

 

[Grace_Adler]

In some cases terminating parental rights terminates child support, in some it does not. I think it's basically up to the judge.

Right, she does not have the right to visitation, custody or making decisions regarding the child, ect.

As far as legal remedies to keep her from interfering and sneaking around, I don't know how you handle that.

 

[Boxcarbill]

O.K. cutting to the chase. Montana law regarding the effect of an order of termination of parental rights:

42-2-617. Effect of order terminating parental rights. (1) An order granting the petition for termination of parental rights:
(a) terminates the parent and child relationship except for an obligation for arrearages of child support;
(b) terminates the jurisdiction of the court over the child in any dissolution or separate maintenance action;
(c) extinguishes any right the parent had to withhold consent to a proposed adoption of the child or to further notice of a proceeding for adoption; and
(d) awards custody of the child to the department, agency, or prospective adoptive parent to whom the relinquishment was given if the department, agency, or prospective adoptive parent has agreed in writing to accept custody of the child until the adoption is finalized.
(2) A person accepting custody is responsible for the support of the child.

History: En. Sec. 77, Ch. 480, L. 1997.

http://data.opi.state.mt.us/bills/mca/42/2/42-2-617.htm

Now I will ask again, is your inquiry concerning a custody order or an order of termination of Parental Rights?

 

[VeronicaGia]

IAAL

Thanks for that update on information in CA. That really surprises me considering Gov. Davis' recent decision against paternity fraud.

BoxcarBill - thank you too, for your info. Once again, I'm surprised but have no problem admitting that I was wrong. This is not the norm, but it now appears both CA and MT are changing the laws.

I learn something every day