Parenting time changes

[anisaerah]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan
I know this is long, but bear with me. I have lurked on this forum long enough that I know lots of additional questions end up being asked

I have been divorced from My ex-husband for about 5 years. We have a 9 year old daughter. 4 years ago, he moved to Tennessee with less than a days notice. (and three weeks before she was to start Kindergarten!) Prior to that, we had a shared custody situation (court-ordered), with each of us having an equal amount of overnights. He moved back to the Detroit area this spring, only notifying our daughter and myself that he had moved back after he had already filed motions to reduce his child support (he has been unemployed since last August, and missed a show cause hearing regarding unpaid child support last November, causing him to have a bench warrant out) and requesting a 50/50 schedule again.

While he was living in Tennessee, she visited him at Christmas and for half the summer. Occasionally, he came up to see her, usually with very little notice, but I always made sure they could spend time together when he was in town, because that is what's best for our daughter.

We had a number of hearings with a referee from the Friend of the Court this spring/summer; his child support was reduced by half (it currently covers half her daycare expenses, and that's it), and he was granted every other week in the summer, and every other weekend overnights plus Wednesday after school until 8:30. Holidays and breaks alternate. We were ordered to go to ADEPT conflict resolution classes, which we are currently attending. while we are attending this class, we are not allowed to file any motions.

I have appeared in pro per for all of our hearings; I have a decent enough job that I have been able to support myself and our daughter, even when he hasn't paid child support (the most it's ever been is 300, so it wasn't enough for me to rely on, really, anyhow; her expenses are about 3-4 times that at least!) but I cannot afford a lawyer. He either has a pro bono attorney, or someone in his family is willing to lay out money so he can reduce his support obligation. It makes me feel very apprehensive about going to court, because I always feel like I am going to get railroaded, because I'm, you know, not a lawyer.

He has been asking for more parenting time, and at the last ADEPT class, he stated that he was very hurt that he did not get to spend more time with our daughter. I was and am hesitant to agree to 50/50 overnights, for one because our daughter needs stability and consistency (diagnosed with ADHD), and he still lives with his parents, is not working, and her school has told me that her behavior seems to be more off the days after he has parenting time. He also keeps bringing her to my house on Wednesdays not having completed her homework, and this is stressful, because he drops her off at 8:30, and she goes to bed at 9. He has brought her to school late twice since the beginning of the school year; he only has to take her to school twice a month. He doesn't like taking her to the doctor, and insists I pay for the copays and medications. The other reason is that I am aware of how the Michigan Child Support calculator works, and I cannot afford to both support our daughter and myself if I have to pay him child support every month because he is not working. He currently receives unemployment, but it comes to less than what a full time minimum wage job would pay. I know neither one of us can agree to permanent abatement of child support, and I do not trust him to stick to any agreement we make. The referee at the last hearing regarding child support refused to impute him an income, even at minimum wage, stating that he wasn't going to create a situation where my ex would end up in contempt again.

Yesterday, I offered him Thursday afternoons/evenings in addition to his court ordered Wednesday parenting time. I even offered to type up something we could submit to the court that we could both sign that could be added to our parenting time order. He got very angry at me and said he "deserved" to have more overnights, because he'd been living here for 6 months now (our orders DO NOT state that it was temporary or subject to change if he remained in the area). He is now threatening to take me to court again to get 50/50 (sometimes he threatens full, which I *know* he'd never get) custody, his reasoning is that since he is not working, he can spend more time with her than I can, and that his dad (who had a stroke 2 years ago and has limited function on one side of his body, and was an alcoholic and dependent on prescription pills in the 10 years I knew him when they all lived here before they moved) can watch her when he finds a job instead of paying for latchkey after school or summer camp at the community center in the summer. He also threatens to bring up my mental illness issues, but I am in treatment, on medication, and completely functional and no danger to our child. He certainly thought I was a fit enough parent to be her primary parent for the last 4 years, right?

Do I need to worry about this? Our order is less than 6 months old. Nothing has changed in regards to our daughter. She, of course, thinks he's the most awesome dad in the world, and I have no interest in disabusing her of that notion. That's why I offered him more parenting time. Because I work, and cannot pick her up until just before 6, he actually will be spending basically the same amount of waking time with her that I do if he chooses to pick her up on Thursdays, too.

Is the court likely to see this as a blatant attempt to reduce child support, or am I going to come off as a controlling jerk?

 

[LillianX]

He's going to have to prove a significant change of circumstances in order to have a custody decision revisited only 6 months after it was made. I don't think you have anything to worry about. Relax.

 

[gam]

He's going to have to prove a significant change of circumstances in order to have a custody decision revisited only 6 months after it was made. I don't think you have anything to worry about. Relax.

No he will not have to prove a significant change of circumstances in order to have a custody decision revisited in only 6 months in Mi. Sorry but this just does not apply in Mi, and yes I know the standard and I see everyone posting this all the time to Mi people. But it's not the normal here.

Someone files and that case is heard, even if the other side files to have it thrown out because of no change of circumstance, the case still is heard. Change of circumstance is left for a Judge(or in Mi it can be a Ref to)to decide, and I have with my own ears heard several Judges say, the change is the parent asked for it, so case is fully heard. 8 years I have been sitting in these Mi court rooms and I have never seen a case thrown out for no change of circumstance.

There is no set rule on how often you can file. I know of several cases where one parent filed something every month for a year straight.

Now with that being said, I don't know first hand knowledge of all the circuit courts in Mi, but the ones I know, this does not work the way it is suppose to. Now OP should consult a lawyer in her area to see how that particular court is on this.

 

[gam]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? Michigan

I have been divorced from My ex-husband for about 5 years. We have a 9 year old daughter. 4 years ago, he moved to Tennessee with less than a days notice. (and three weeks before she was to start Kindergarten!) Prior to that, we had a shared custody situation (court-ordered), with each of us having an equal amount of overnights. He moved back to the Detroit area this spring, only notifying our daughter and myself that he had moved back after he had already filed motions to reduce his child support (he has been unemployed since last August, and missed a show cause hearing regarding unpaid child support last November, causing him to have a bench warrant out) and requesting a 50/50 schedule again.

Who ordered the first 50/50? Was it a Judge, Ref or mediator?

We had a number of hearings with a referee from the Friend of the Court this spring/summer; his child support was reduced by half (it currently covers half her daycare expenses, and that's it), and he was granted every other week in the summer, and every other weekend overnights plus Wednesday after school until 8:30. Holidays and breaks alternate. We were ordered to go to ADEPT conflict resolution classes, which we are currently attending. while we are attending this class, we are not allowed to file any motions.

Did you know Referee's DO NOT MAKE ORDERS? They only make recommendations. Did you know THAT YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO OBJECT TO THE REFEREE? If you do not object that recommendation goes to the Judge and he/she signs off on it. If you object it then goes before the Judge for a hearing with the Judge. I have seen more Judges change the Ref's recommendation then order that recommendation. However if you don't object, they sign off on it. Does the current order cover the base CS, daycare and medical? I don't mean the total dollar amounts, I mean does the actual order have a section for each of these.

How far does dad now live from child? Honestly not many JUDGES will order an every other week visitation in the summer unless there is a distance. Sounds to me like you just took whatever the Ref recommended and got that. Who said your not allowed to follow any motions? Cause even if that is written in an order signed by a Judge, guess what someone can file a motion and it will be heard. There excuse will be, but she won't work with me at all, what was I suppose to do.

I have appeared in pro per for all of our hearings; I have a decent enough job that I have been able to support myself and our daughter, even when he hasn't paid child support (the most it's ever been is 300, so it wasn't enough for me to rely on, really, anyhow; her expenses are about 3-4 times that at least!) but I cannot afford a lawyer. He either has a pro bono attorney, or someone in his family is willing to lay out money so he can reduce his support obligation. It makes me feel very apprehensive about going to court, because I always feel like I am going to get railroaded, because I'm, you know, not a lawyer.

Since you don't have knowledge I do recommend you seek a lawyer. However you can do this without, and do well, I have seen many do this in Mi courts. But you need to learn, and I am thinking you don't even know the basics, since your orders seem to come from mediators and Refs. You need to learn your rights, you need to learn your circuit court and your FOC. You need to know them well and stop being railroaded.

He has been asking for more parenting time, and at the last ADEPT class, he stated that he was very hurt that he did not get to spend more time with our daughter. I was and am hesitant to agree to 50/50 overnights, for one because our daughter needs stability and consistency (diagnosed with ADHD), and he still lives with his parents, is not working, and her school has told me that her behavior seems to be more off the days after he has parenting time. He also keeps bringing her to my house on Wednesdays not having completed her homework, and this is stressful, because he drops her off at 8:30, and she goes to bed at 9. He has brought her to school late twice since the beginning of the school year; he only has to take her to school twice a month. He doesn't like taking her to the doctor, and insists I pay for the copays and medications. The other reason is that I am aware of how the Michigan Child Support calculator works, and I cannot afford to both support our daughter and myself if I have to pay him child support every month because he is not working. He currently receives unemployment, but it comes to less than what a full time minimum wage job would pay. I know neither one of us can agree to permanent abatement of child support, and I do not trust him to stick to any agreement we make. The referee at the last hearing regarding child support refused to impute him an income, even at minimum wage, stating that he wasn't going to create a situation where my ex would end up in contempt again.

Again you said Ref, did you object to the Ref's recommendation of not imputing him? Do you know the Child support formula manual on imputing? Read it, understand why they can not impute and how they have to go about that. Understand how to argue it and understand that you can object to the Ref. A Judge can decide that your ex has not learned his lesson and throw him in contempt again, with stiffer penalities. A Judge might not either but I have seen many do this.

Yesterday, I offered him Thursday afternoons/evenings in addition to his court ordered Wednesday parenting time. I even offered to type up something we could submit to the court that we could both sign that could be added to our parenting time order. He got very angry at me and said he "deserved" to have more overnights, because he'd been living here for 6 months now (our orders DO NOT state that it was temporary or subject to change if he remained in the area). He is now threatening to take me to court again to get 50/50 (sometimes he threatens full, which I *know* he'd never get) custody, his reasoning is that since he is not working, he can spend more time with her than I can, and that his dad (who had a stroke 2 years ago and has limited function on one side of his body, and was an alcoholic and dependent on prescription pills in the 10 years I knew him when they all lived here before they moved) can watch her when he finds a job instead of paying for latchkey after school or summer camp at the community center in the summer. He also threatens to bring up my mental illness issues, but I am in treatment, on medication, and completely functional and no danger to our child. He certainly thought I was a fit enough parent to be her primary parent for the last 4 years, right?

If your under care for you mental illness, and you have been a capable parent for the past 4 years, and can prove your under care and have nothing he can provide that proves your not a capable parent, this should be good. But he can file for custody anytime he wants, and it will be heard. You will have to prove your capable, your illness is under control and you have to prove why it is not better to have dad, who can be full time caretaker since he is unemployed is not better for the child. Focus there would be on uprooting the child from her normal routine and that dad has not participated and still is not in school, homework, doctors, things in this area.

Do I need to worry about this? Our order is less than 6 months old. Nothing has changed in regards to our daughter. She, of course, thinks he's the most awesome dad in the world, and I have no interest in disabusing her of that notion. That's why I offered him more parenting time. Because I work, and cannot pick her up until just before 6, he actually will be spending basically the same amount of waking time with her that I do if he chooses to pick her up on Thursdays, too.

Is the court likely to see this as a blatant attempt to reduce child support, or am I going to come off as a controlling jerk?[/

QUOTE]

Can't predict any of this, it's up to how a JUDGE sees it. I made Judge big, cause it is a Judge not a Ref you need to have the final say on this. Again he can file, it will be heard. But if he does, you need to focus on what you have in this thread. Your reasons are not of a controlling jerk, they are focused on what is best for all, how to give more time and you still responsible for major stuff, that he is not doing now that he is back. Then can see him as doing this to reduce child support, but do not have that be your focus in this, you bring that up and then move on to the other more important stuff you have going for you.

 

[anisaerah]

I live in Oakland county, if that helps.

I am aware that I have a right to object to the referee's orders. However, at the hearing for parenting time, I used the last vacation day I had. I had to appear by phone for the follow-up hearing about child support (this was delayed because he was not working, and they said they wanted to gove hima chance to get a job.), and that was when the referee refused to impute him income. From what I recall, he did not use the formula, just lowered the support from 300 to 180. He has been required to appear a few times for contempt because he still owes me about $2000 in arrears, but at the last show cause hearing, he just said he was looking for work, and the referee said "ok." and took the next case. I wasn't even allowed to say anything. FOC tells me I should show up for these hearings, and that if I do not show up, they assume it's not important to me, but I can't risk losing my job because I am the only one supporting her!

the original 50/50 order came about because when he filed for divorce, he also filed for full custody. I was living with my mother, and she said she would not agree to having my daughter there full time, so in my response, I asked for 50/50 custody, becasue I was aware that if I agreed to every other weekend that I would never have more custody than that.

I agreed to every other week in the summer because he was asking for most of the summer in a block, as that was "status quo". I tried to argue that now that he was living locally, that was irrelevant, but the referee and his assistant disagreed with me. I suggested every other week because I thought it was best for our daughter to spend time with both of us throughout the summer. Even though he had her every other week, I still had to pay for childcare at 155+ a week, because he said he was looking for work, and I did not think it was appropriate for someone as disabled (and possibly chemically dependent) as his father is to watch her all day when/if he found a job. He lives about 8 miles from me. She goes to school in a neighboring district to both of us (schools of choice); his lawyer has stated in court that he lives closer to her school, but he doesn't; he lives about 5 miles away, and I live 2.5. We both live close enough that the point seems pretty moot to me anyhow.

I hate having hearings in front of the referee. Every time motions are filed, though, they knock it back to FOC, and I have a limited amount of time I can take off from work- and that's dependent on if they approve my time off, whether I have time available or not.

Most of my vacation time goes toward staying home with her when she gets sick (she also has asthma, and she's out of school for a couple days a few times a year when she gets severe colds/flu). When she had bronchitis in May, he did take care of her for two days, and took her to the doctor, but accused me of "dropping all the responsibility on him", and refused to pick up her antibiotics. I had to send my dad to pay for them, because I was at work, and the pharmacy would not take my debit card over the phone.

I do not understand why I stand to lose custody because I have been providing for our daughter. I have no choice but to work, especially since he will not (I am friendly with his sister, and she says he has turned down jobs because it would keep him from spending time with our daughter. I do not have that luxury.) It's not as if she is a toddler who needs full-time care. He picks her up from latchkey at 4:15; I pick her up at 6. I am not sure how to prove that I am capable of parenting my child, other than the fact that I *have been doing so by myself* for the last 4 years. Is a 35 year old who is unemployed and has never lived on his own really considered more stable than someone who has had the same job for 5 years, maintains a household for the child, and does hot have a history of moving in and out of state with no notice?

I am planning on consulting with an attorney; my union does have a legal services program that offers a discount, and free consultations, but I will not have a big enough chunk of money to actually pay an attorney until I get my tax refund in March, provided my car does not eat the money up with repairs.

 

[LillianX]

No he will not have to prove a significant change of circumstances in order to have a custody decision revisited in only 6 months in Mi. Sorry but this just does not apply in Mi, and yes I know the standard and I see everyone posting this all the time to Mi people. But it's not the normal here.

Someone files and that case is heard, even if the other side files to have it thrown out because of no change of circumstance, the case still is heard. Change of circumstance is left for a Judge(or in Mi it can be a Ref to)to decide, and I have with my own ears heard several Judges say, the change is the parent asked for it, so case is fully heard. 8 years I have been sitting in these Mi court rooms and I have never seen a case thrown out for no change of circumstance.

There is no set rule on how often you can file. I know of several cases where one parent filed something every month for a year straight.

Now with that being said, I don't know first hand knowledge of all the circuit courts in Mi, but the ones I know, this does not work the way it is suppose to. Now OP should consult a lawyer in her area to see how that particular court is on this.

Yes. It DOES apply in Michigan. http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/resources/publications/manuals/focb/custodyguideline.pdf

 

[CJane]

Yes. It DOES apply in Michigan. http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/resources/publications/manuals/focb/custodyguideline.pdf

What I think gam is saying, and what I've tried to say before regarding MY state, is that "No change in circumstances" is not a valid reason to have a motion dismissed. It's just very very very unlikely to work.

A judge will want to listen to the facts of the case, hold a hearing/trial, and determine for his/herself, based on those facts and the evidence, whether or not a significant change has taken place.

And the judge has pretty broad discretion in determining what rises to the level of significant change. It's something that's appealed occasionally, but not many parents can afford the appeals process.

 

[anisaerah]

What I think gam is saying, and what I've tried to say before regarding MY state, is that "No change in circumstances" is not a valid reason to have a motion dismissed. It's just very very very unlikely to work.

A judge will want to listen to the facts of the case, hold a hearing/trial, and determine for his/herself, based on those facts and the evidence, whether or not a significant change has taken place.

And the judge has pretty broad discretion in determining what rises to the level of significant change. It's something that's appealed occasionally, but not many parents can afford the appeals process.

So, basically, he can keep taking me back to court when there have been no actual changes in our child's life (other than that he's not happy with paying child support), causing me to lose my job so she has neither parent able to support her? He has already told me numerous times that he hopes he causes me to lose my job.

I know life isn't fair, and that anyone who tells you any different is selling something, but that just seems really wrong to me, and not in our child's best interest.

 

[CJane]

So, basically, he can keep taking me back to court when there have been no actual changes in our child's life (other than that he's not happy with paying child support), causing me to lose my job so she has neither parent able to support her? He has already told me numerous times that he hopes he causes me to lose my job.

I know life isn't fair, and that anyone who tells you any different is selling something, but that just seems really wrong to me, and not in our child's best interest.

If your job is truly in jeopardy from making court appearances that aren't required, it might be in your best interests to retain an attorney to make those appearances for you. Long term, it's probably less expensive than losing your job.

But yes, he has the right to file motions. And 99% of the time, the court will hear them before determining that they're frivolous. And if the court DOES determine that they're frivolous, you stand a good chance of getting your attorney's fees paid by him.

 

[TheGeekess]

So, basically, he can keep taking me back to court when there have been no actual changes in our child's life (other than that he's not happy with paying child support), causing me to lose my job so she has neither parent able to support her? He has already told me numerous times that he hopes he causes me to lose my job.

I know life isn't fair, and that anyone who tells you any different is selling something, but that just seems really wrong to me, and not in our child's best interest.

Do you have an attorney? Every time he files and you respond, file to have him responsible for your attorney's fees. The judge may or may not allow it, but sooner or later the judge will get tired of seeing Dad's name cross his desk.

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

It is BIG time in Michigan that there has to be a change of circumstances in the CHILD'S life for the COC.

http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/selfhelp/family/custody_help.htm

http://courts.michigan.gov/scao/selfhelp/intro/court.htm

http://www.traversecityfamilylaw.com/Documents/Schemanski_v_Skank.pdf

http://www.hg.org/article.asp?id=20351

have many more, but these should cover it.

 

[LillianX]

What I think gam is saying, and what I've tried to say before regarding MY state, is that "No change in circumstances" is not a valid reason to have a motion dismissed. It's just very very very unlikely to work.

A judge will want to listen to the facts of the case, hold a hearing/trial, and determine for his/herself, based on those facts and the evidence, whether or not a significant change has taken place.

And the judge has pretty broad discretion in determining what rises to the level of significant change. It's something that's appealed occasionally, but not many parents can afford the appeals process.

Perhaps, but that's not the case in Michigan. Michigan is pretty strict about it.

 

[CJane]

It is BIG time in Michigan that there has to be a change of circumstances in the CHILD'S life for the COC.

Changing a Child Custody Order Self Help

selfhelp: Going to Court; Where to Start

http://www.traversecityfamilylaw.com/Documents/Schemanski_v_Skank.pdf

When Can I Modify a Child Custody or Visitation Order in Michigan?

have many more, but these should cover it.

I don't think anyone is saying that to change custody there doesn't need to be a COC. What was being said is that a hearing will be held and the decision revisited whether the PARTIES think there's a COC or not.

 

[TinkerBelleLuvr]

So, basically, he can keep taking me back to court when there have been no actual changes in our child's life (other than that he's not happy with paying child support), causing me to lose my job so she has neither parent able to support her? He has already told me numerous times that he hopes he causes me to lose my job.

I know life isn't fair, and that anyone who tells you any different is selling something, but that just seems really wrong to me, and not in our child's best interest.

If the filing is frivolous, ask that the judge sanction the behavior. If you have an attorney filing for you, ask that he be responsible for attorney fees.

 

[CJane]

Perhaps, but that's not the case in Michigan. Michigan is pretty strict about it.

Really?

So, in MI, Dad files a motion to change custody stating that something significant has changed in the child's life.

Mom files a motion to dismiss, saying "Nope, no changes." And the judge decides right then and there whether or not to dismiss the case? Without hearing any evidence or facts? Without a hearing at all?