What else should we do?

[dos8395]

What is the name of your state? VA. I wrote the other day & got much needed advice, thank you! To recap; my son & his ex (never married) have "joint legal custody" of thier son, with "shared physical". Jurisdiction is in VA. Mom lives in Arizona, Dad lives in VA.

Yesterday I flew out to Arizona to get the baby. His Daddys court ordered parenting time started yesterday. I was authorized to fly & she had plenty of notification... Anyway, the mom & baby didn't show up. I contacted the police. They filed a police report "Intereference With Custodial Order". They also did a "welfare check" of moms last known address; a family member said that Mom & baby had gone to Colorado. The family member said she didn't have an address. I also asked the police we were seeking "relief under the Parental Kidnapping Prevention Act (PKPA)." They acted kind of confused about that & then said it was included in report they took. Was it really?!

According to the custody agreement, each parent is supposed to give the other parent 30 days notice of a move; a phone number & address must remain current ~ my son hasn't even been able to talk to mom or son in 3 or 4 weeks now! Son filed contempt papers today. The person my son spoke to at the courthouse said that he would receive notice of a hearing by mail (so will she at her last known address). And the hearing will take place in 6 to 8 weeks & she is supposed to bring the baby back for that. Well, heck, she was also supposed to meet me at the airport!!! Does this mean that he has to wait that long to see his son? He doesn't have an address or a home #, just a "contact #". He has called continously for 3 or 4 weeks now. The contact number is moms sisters, but she won't pick up phone. The sister said she was going to file harrasment charges on my son because he calls so much! YES looking for his son!!! He is VERY careful of the messages he leaves. Is there no recourse or law etc that he has to demand the immediate return of his child? This does not seem to make much sense! This is the second time mom has run; but only once after court order was in place ~ which was put in place cause of the 1st time she ran!

The mom said she didn't return the child because a)the baby would be spending the majority of his time with us, the grandparents. (Not true.) & b) she spoke to a lawyer in VA & was told she didn't have to return child because jurisdiction isn't in VA... but that's where custody order is!

So. Anything my son should do to get immediate return of child (family members know where she is)? He has called the police in VA. & they said since the babys mom has him, it's a "civil matter". Does the Parental Kidnapping Prevention Act apply? Are we obligated to just wait? Anything else we should be doing?

Sorry, I made this a long post again. Thanks so much!

 

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state? VA. I wrote the other day & got much needed advice, thank you! To recap; my son & his ex (never married) have "joint legal custody" of thier son, with "shared physical". Jurisdiction is in VA. Mom lives in Arizona, Dad lives in VA.

Yesterday I flew out to Arizona to get the baby. His Daddys court ordered parenting time started yesterday. I was authorized to fly & she had plenty of notification... Anyway, the mom & baby didn't show up. I contacted the police. They filed a police report "Intereference With Custodial Order". They also did a "welfare check" of moms last known address; a family member said that Mom & baby had gone to Colorado. The family member said she didn't have an address. I also asked the police we were seeking "relief under the Parental Kidnapping Prevention Act (PKPA)." They acted kind of confused about that & then said it was included in report they took. Was it really?!

According to the custody agreement, each parent is supposed to give the other parent 30 days notice of a move; a phone number & address must remain current ~ my son hasn't even been able to talk to mom or son in 3 or 4 weeks now! Son filed contempt papers today. The person my son spoke to at the courthouse said that he would receive notice of a hearing by mail (so will she at her last known address). And the hearing will take place in 6 to 8 weeks & she is supposed to bring the baby back for that. Well, heck, she was also supposed to meet me at the airport!!! Does this mean that he has to wait that long to see his son? He doesn't have an address or a home #, just a "contact #". He has called continously for 3 or 4 weeks now. The contact number is moms sisters, but she won't pick up phone. The sister said she was going to file harrasment charges on my son because he calls so much! YES looking for his son!!! He is VERY careful of the messages he leaves. Is there no recourse or law etc that he has to demand the immediate return of his child? This does not seem to make much sense! This is the second time mom has run; but only once after court order was in place ~ which was put in place cause of the 1st time she ran!

The mom said she didn't return the child because a)the baby would be spending the majority of his time with us, the grandparents. (Not true.) & b) she spoke to a lawyer in VA & was told she didn't have to return child because jurisdiction isn't in VA... but that's where custody order is!

So. Anything my son should do to get immediate return of child (family members know where she is)? He has called the police in VA. & they said since the babys mom has him, it's a "civil matter". Does the Parental Kidnapping Prevention Act apply? Are we obligated to just wait? Anything else we should be doing?

Sorry, I made this a long post again. Thanks so much!

There are multiple problems/complications here. Your son can't serve mom because he doesn't know where she is and because service by publication wouldn't do him any good because she has the child. Serving her last known address, when he knows she isn't there anymore, just sets him up to have any default ruling overturned later. Plus, I honestly don't think that a judge would give him a default ruling when he doesn't have physical possession of the child....and doesn't even know where the child is so that he could gain physical possession.

She does have custody so I don't think this qualifies as a parental kidnapping...I think it qualifies as denial of parenting time/visitation and contempt of court....but I don't know that he is going to be able to do anything about it until he finds her....and the police have already made it clear that they don't consider it a kidnapping.

If the funds are available you probably need a private investigator.

Continuing to call the sister when you know that mom and the child aren't there could possibly qualify as harassment.

 

[dos8395]

How does mom "have custody"??? It's supposed to be joint & his parenting time was supposed to start yesterday. Jurisdiction & court order are in VA where son lives, pays taxes & childcare & works... How is he supposed to get an address ~ (there are no funds for a private investigator.) She is defying the court order by not providing one. That sounds crazy! Seriously, she can hide the child, defy the court order, & he can't even serve her with contempt because she's ... well, hiding the child & defying the court order!

 

[dos8395]

What is "service by publication"???

What is "service by publication"??? We know what town she is in. Also, the phone number my son has is the sisters... but babys mom is with her...

 

[LdiJ]

How does mom "have custody"??? It's supposed to be joint & his parenting time was supposed to start yesterday. Jurisdiction & court order are in VA where son lives, pays taxes & childcare & works... How is he supposed to get an address ~ (there are no funds for a private investigator.) She is defying the court order by not providing one. That sounds crazy! Seriously, she can hide the child, defy the court order, & he can't even serve her with contempt because she's ... well, hiding the child & defying the court order!

Yep...I know its a bit of a paradox....but the law requires that someone must be served...and there are very good reasons why that is a requirement. If he had the child and mom up and disappeared, basically abandoning the child, then he could get temporary custody ex-parte...but he doesn't have the child. Even if he got lucky and a judge was willing to make that kind of order without him having physical possession of the child....he would still have to find her to enforce the order.

Yes, she has custody....even if its joint she still has custody...they both do in that case.

I realize that you feel that mom's family should be forced to reveal her whereabouts....assuming that they actually know where she is. However the police have already indicated that they won't treat this as a kidnapping...and the VA judge has no authority over her family members unless they live in VA...and even then its questionable whether the judge could force them to do anything, because they are not parties to the case.

He is going to have to find her.

 

[dos8395]

Okayyy

What about "Intereference With Custodial Order"??? Does that "do" anything? My son was reluctant to give him back last time, but we all encouraged him to "do the right thing". Now I wish he had ran, if the laws protect the runners...

 

[LdiJ]

What about "Intereference With Custodial Order"??? Does that "do" anything? My son was reluctant to give him back last time, but we all encouraged him to "do the right thing". Now I wish he had ran, if the laws protect the runners...

The law doesn't protect the runners...running is foolish because it never has a positive end result. Yes, "Interference with a custodial order" does things...but again, in VA I think it takes 3 or 4 times of denying parenting time before any serious consequences come into effect...and even then, its questionable whether or not VA could impose a penalty for that to someone who is not a resident of VA.

Ok...you said that mom is supposedly in CO and her family in AZ don't have an address for her. Then you state that she is with her sister. If she is definitely with her sister then you may be able to find her by doing a background check on the sister to get a current address. However you would have to somehow verify that mom was there in order to serve her there.

 

[kat1963]

Try the post office, she probably had her mail transfered.

KAT

 

[LdiJ]

Try the post office, she probably had her mail transfered.

KAT

"Runners" generally don't do that....or they are also running from the bill collectors. They know its a way they can be traced.

 

[dos8395]

More info

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What is the name of your state?VA

I posted a new thread, but was told to add it here ! I've been getting advice, under post "What else should we do".
To clarify. Mom has her mother & some siblings in Arizona. She was living with her mom, & that's the address the court has. Several other sisters, some aunts & a grandmother live in CO. We have some people in CO. too. So, I guess I wasn't real clear.

Yesterday, while son was at courthouse, a sister from AZ called & said babys mom was passing a message through her ~ babys mom would call son on Fri. She also said mom of baby was VISITING CO., not living there. This family is all very "clannish". 10 living siblings, NONE of them have ever lived on "thier own". 3 (never 2) or 4 or 5 will pile up in a house, apt. & live together... with all the kids; in AZ. they usually live with thier Mom. They just move en` masse from place to place. They just think it's "strange" a Daddy wants to be involved. My grandson, 20 months, has lived in 8 places (documented) between AZ & Co. Usually, utilities are in whoevers name is convienent, & they jump from job to job... Forwarding mail isn't something they would even think of doing. This sounds bad, but it's just a different lifestyle, & they all love thier kids. My son has kept the same home in VA. for nearly 2 years & he & babys mom lived there together; briefly. Son also has an excellent job; & has recently been promoted ~ he is the youngest person (20 years) to have this position. He has a licensed day care provider, as well. And a car & drivers license, which the mom doesn't. (She's just never felt a need to get one, it wasn't "taken away").

The custodial interference report was drawn up in AZ. so hopefully, something can be done. We just cannot believe it will take up to 8 weeks for Daddy to see his son. That's just not right...

My question I guess is this : Son has already filed "contempt". Should he file a "motion to modify" as well? Should we be doing anything else? Thank you again!