Questions about my NY DWI

[Clock]

Three years

Thanks!

I'm kind of treating this thread as a very detailed journal in the case it might help someone else out or someone has something to add currently. I know when I was scouring through the internet when I was first arrested I would have appreciated reading the nitty gritty of the whole process and definitely appreciated reading other peoples' accounts. If this is against the rules or something, I'll stop.

So I just got out of my arraignment. In what feels very refreshing considering the bleakness of everything else surrounding this, I managed to get the hardship license.

Basically what happened was my lawyer and I were called up to the stand, my lawyer waived reading, and after setting a court date he handed the judge a motion for the hardship license. This contained all of the information I had told my lawyer before, such as how many people were in the house with licenses and why they couldn't drive me to work, why I couldn't take a cab / bus to work, etc.

The judge accepted without asking any questions. I gave up my license to him, we moved over to the clerk and got the police report (we didn't explicitly ask for it) and the piece of paper that is my hardship license, and that was it. Total time spent from the moment we were called up to walking out the door was no more than ten minutes.

In the meantime, I'm told that I misunderstood what my lawyer was saying about the accident preventing the DWAI - the fact that there was an accident involved isn't outright preventing it from being an option, but because it isn't settled yet through the insurance companies due to not getting that police report (which I now have), we can't push for the plea yet. The idea is to basically put together a portfolio that includes stuff like the fact that noone was injured, that the insurance is settled, that I don't have any prior convictions or points on my license / first time offender / etc etc and then presenting it to get the plea bargain.

My lawyer says he's taking it from here, and if he needs anything from me he'll call. Although the huge unknown as to whether or not I'll get the plea is obviously going to be nagging at me constantly, it's somewhat comforting to be finished with the arraignment and knowing that I won't have any disruptions getting to and from work anymore. Any sort of "win" at this point is huge for me.

 

[blankz]

I'm currently going through the same ordeal.

I attended a party where I was celebrating my recent hire at an IB, graduating school and my purchase of a CO-OP. I drove to the city, gave keys to a friend knowing that I was going to drink a lot. Blanked out around 1am, woke up in the driver seat of my car around 4am after hitting a pole. This happened on the West side, near 31st and dyer st a few blocks from Penn Station.

I'm totally glad that I didn't injure myself, more importantly did not hit an innocent pedestrian.

I'm doing 23, had minor fender bender last year, never been arrested (until this =(... ), first time offender DWI.

Like you, I hold a good job, did well in school, volunteer around fifty hours a year community service and help low income people file tax returns.

However, I blew a .156 where they rounded up to a .16....

I sat spent the night in jail, did the video interview, took the test in the precinct (so i imagine my BAC was higher during the accident) and had an absolutely miserable time. I plan to sell my car after i fix it, or give it to a family member. I couldn't believe I did something so recklessly and did not want to put myself in that position again.

I hooked up with a lawyer, Paul Lieber while awaiting for a public defendant. I don't know if I can trust his interest in doing whatever he can to help me get a DWAI or something that isn't a criminal conviction. He found me somehow.

Like you, I'm doing as much research as I can, and I don't know if I made the right decision in paying $1500 for this guy. Also what should I be doing now? I really don't need a car, i don't care about my driving privileges and I just don't want to have a criminal record.

Any advice on what I should be doing now? Also, I remember filling out new hire forms and I said I was never arrested for anything before. Now, I don't know if this will change anything.

Also, I have Allstate and someone told me not to report anything to my insurance company as far as my arrest and DWI is concerned. That I should lie saying that I hit a pole, called a tow truck and thats it, even go as far as to say that the police was not involved. Would anyone go against that advice? Anything will be very helpful. Thanks in advance

 

[blankz]

sorry, I thought this forum was directed at New Yorkers. Penn Station is in Manhattan, NY

 

[Clock]

I'm currently going through the same ordeal.

I attended a party where I was celebrating my recent hire at an IB, graduating school and my purchase of a CO-OP. I drove to the city, gave keys to a friend knowing that I was going to drink a lot. Blanked out around 1am, woke up in the driver seat of my car around 4am after hitting a pole. This happened on the West side, near 31st and dyer st a few blocks from Penn Station.

I'm totally glad that I didn't injure myself, more importantly did not hit an innocent pedestrian.

I'm doing 23, had minor fender bender last year, never been arrested (until this =(... ), first time offender DWI.

Like you, I hold a good job, did well in school, volunteer around fifty hours a year community service and help low income people file tax returns.

However, I blew a .156 where they rounded up to a .16....

I sat spent the night in jail, did the video interview, took the test in the precinct (so i imagine my BAC was higher during the accident) and had an absolutely miserable time. I plan to sell my car after i fix it, or give it to a family member. I couldn't believe I did something so recklessly and did not want to put myself in that position again.

I hooked up with a lawyer, Paul Lieber while awaiting for a public defendant. I don't know if I can trust his interest in doing whatever he can to help me get a DWAI or something that isn't a criminal conviction. He found me somehow.

Like you, I'm doing as much research as I can, and I don't know if I made the right decision in paying $1500 for this guy. Also what should I be doing now? I really don't need a car, i don't care about my driving privileges and I just don't want to have a criminal record.

Any advice on what I should be doing now? Also, I remember filling out new hire forms and I said I was never arrested for anything before. Now, I don't know if this will change anything.

Also, I have Allstate and someone told me not to report anything to my insurance company as far as my arrest and DWI is concerned. That I should lie saying that I hit a pole, called a tow truck and thats it, even go as far as to say that the police was not involved. Would anyone go against that advice? Anything will be very helpful. Thanks in advance

Your insurance WILL find out about it. Just get past that hump and accept it. The bad news is your prices will go up - the good news is that there are quite a few insurance companies who only look back three years, so keep a clean record and in the meantime just suck up the costs. You can always raise your deductibles to help eat some of the increased costs. Definitely take the defensive driver class, which will shave 10% off of your insurance. Mine only cost 60 bucks to take. Don't take the class until AFTER you are convicted - this way the class will take off four of the points you will get from whatever you are charged with. Anyhow - lying to your insurance company is undoubtedly a bad idea, but volunteering information that they didn't ask about won't help you out either. IF they don't ask about police involvement, then don't volunteer it. If they do, give it to them.

As far as what you do now, there's nothing much more you can. Tell your lawyer that your only goal is to get a DWAI plea bargain and keep your record clean if that is your sole objective. Tell him that you would like him to call the DA before your arraignment to see if he can work out a plea bargain immediately if possible. He may or may not be able to, but if the chance exists that you might be able to take your DWAI conviction right at your arraignment, then that's about the best scenario you can hope for. Don't expect it to happen, though.

Since you don't really care about keeping your license right now, then you don't have to worry about attempting to get a hardship (nor do you have to ask your lawyer to spend time, and thus lots of your money). Don't worry about this too much - you'll most likely be eligible to get a restricted license 30 days after your license is taken away from you (this will occur at your arraignment).

As far as keeping your record clean - I did a little scouring on the internet and talked to a few HR friends of mine. The vasty majority of information that I'm seeing is that DWIs / DUIs are relatively common and will NOT get in the way of you getting hired somewhere provided it isn't a driving job and that you are up front about it, ie before they run the background check, "On an otherwise spotless record you'll see that I got a DWI x amount of years ago. It was a stupid mistake that I'm happy to say I've learned from. I just want to be up front and put everything on the table." Obviously you don't want a record if you can avoid it, but know that DWIs aren't exactly rare things for HR departments in any job. They're mostly looking for embezzlement and the like.

So basically, HOPE for the DWAI, but EXPECT the DWI. The DWI will obviously sting more, just remember that this is a pretty common conviction and won't put a scarlet letter on you unless your job is based on driving, you just have to be honest about it and express that you've learned your lesson at interviews... and obviously don't do it again.

Good luck!

 

[RatPackLar]

No Contest Plea

Never plead guity, it could be used against you in a Civil Suit if the other guy, or his insurance company decides to sue you for damamges, like the deductable, and or any money they think they could get from you and or your insurance company.

The requirements for a civil suit, are simple, a preponderance of the evidence, meaning they have more evidence that says you are guily, then you have, that says you are not.

You plead guilty in the criminal court, and they will use that against you, and you will probably lose. Hey he plead guilty in the crminal court, so he is guilty and should pay.

People see easy money, and a deep pocket insurance company, and they go for the bucks every time.

My brother was in head on collision with a buddy in the car. No booze, no nothing, and he was not at fault. The injuries to both were minor

His buddy, then tried to sue our insurance company thinking he could get easy money.

The insurance company ended up settling for some squat amount, but the point is, anybody can sue anybody.

These days, anybody can sue anybody, for anything, and they do. Look at the Judge who sued that drycleaner for $50 million, cause he said they lost his pants.

It got tossed, but it cost the drycleaner money and lots of it.

Good luck!

 

[Clock]

Here's a good article explaining how to handle a DWI / DUI at a job interview and how interviewers and HR departments GENERALLY view them. (Again - a DWAI will NOT show up on a background check in NY. Not sure about other states.)

http://www.businessweek.com/careers/content/jul2002/ca20020717_1599.htm

 

[blankz]

Thanks for your help Clock.

I really hope the money for this lawyer is worth it. A lot of friends that don't know much about DWI/DUI suggest that a public defendant for a first-time offender is just fine. My court date is on July 22nd, and this other person told me that these lawyers would post-pone everything for about a year or whatever and it any benefit would be negligible by that time.

Has your lawyer contacted you in regards to anything you can do (i.e., providing a reference letter from your boss saying how a mature responsible person you are, any good things that you've done and such, etc.) ?

Also, my lawyer told me to see a CASAC (Credentialed Alcoholism & Substance Abuse Counselor) instead of the list of assessment centers that the court gave me. I'm not knowledgeable with technical law jargon, so I don't even know what an arraignment is. After being in a precinct for a night then off to central bookings for about 6 hours I saw the judge was given an ROR.

What a nightmare, I wish I was telling a story from GTA IV or something.

 

[Clock]

Thanks for your help Clock.

I really hope the money for this lawyer is worth it. A lot of friends that don't know much about DWI/DUI suggest that a public defendant for a first-time offender is just fine. My court date is on July 22nd, and this other person told me that these lawyers would post-pone everything for about a year or whatever and it any benefit would be negligible by that time.

Has your lawyer contacted you in regards to anything you can do (i.e., providing a reference letter from your boss saying how a mature responsible person you are, any good things that you've done and such, etc.) ?

Also, my lawyer told me to see a CASAC (Credentialed Alcoholism & Substance Abuse Counselor) instead of the list of assessment centers that the court gave me. I'm not knowledgeable with technical law jargon, so I don't even know what an arraignment is. After being in a precinct for a night then off to central bookings for about 6 hours I saw the judge was given an ROR.

What a nightmare, I wish I was telling a story from GTA IV or something.

As far as lawyer goes: don't second guess yourself. If you get a public defender and you have to plead guilty to DWI, then you'll always wonder what would have happened if you hadn't been cheap about it. You're doing the right thing (assuming your lawyer is decent, of course).

My lawyer knows me, so I don't really have to get anything for him. My situation at this point is that my lawyer has to write a letter to someone describing my situation because my town generally doesn't allow pleas if an accident was involved by "default." So basically this letter is just going to be composed of stuff like how the rest of my record was clean, that the accident is completely taken care of and that there were no injuries, that I'm an MBA student, etc. Idea is basically just a "Come on, cut him a break" thing, there's nothing really legal-ese about it. I either get this or I plead guilty to a DWI (which I've come to terms with, especially knowing that even though I'll have a record, it's explainable and typically not a huge deal to HR departments for my kind of work and also, that really I deserve it).

So nope, I don't have anything I really have to do at this point.

As far as your CASAC thing, I didn't get any list of assessment centers or whatnot. Literally, I was arrested, released immediately after, went to my arraignment and pled not guilty and got the hardship license, and that's where things are. Nothing else from the court at this point, and probably won't get anything else until I'm convicted of something or go to pre-trial.

Yeah, it is a nightmare, but personally, I had it coming and after this I'm not going to do it again and that's what matters. Look at it as what it is: a hard lesson to make sure you don't screw up again. A year from now it'll be behind you. You'll still be paying high insurance, but whatever. Many companies only look back three years and if you go insurance hunting every year you supposedly come down pretty drastically every year.

Just push through it. It sounds like you're doing all the right things, at least from my perspective. Yeah, it sucks, and yeah, it's especially rough when you go through the whole "Man, a month ago everything was FINE and now..." conversations, but no - now you're not going to drive drunk again. Hell, I don't even drive five over the speed limit on the highway anymore and I stop myself WHENEVER I'm tempted to do something even remotely aggressive on the road now. Forget about driving if I can even remotely feel the alcohol now. I'm buying a breathalyzer soon just to make SURE in the future that I'm never over like .03. There's no way I'd be like this now had something like this not happened, so... that's what I'm "getting" out of it.

 

[blankz]

I'm going to switch lawyers, currently not satisfied with the one that I have now. $1500 fee, $750 paid already, $750 on the court date (7/22/2008) which he will not see. This other lawyer I found said she was a former DA and federal prosecutor and "only" charges $2500 but talked it down to $2000 after knowing that I paid $750. So, I hope I'm making the right decision and will see what happens when I meet with her on Tuesday.

I came across this

Q: IS IT POSSIBLE TO "PLEA BARGAIN" TO AVOID A CONVICTION FOR DRINKING AND DRIVING?
A: No, the law prohibits a plea to a non-alcohol or drug-related violation.

[http://www.nydmv.state.ny.us/broch/c39.htm]

Kind of diminishes my hopes of a DWAI and more of a reality check. *sigh*

Just got off the phone with my insurance adjuster, $8800 in damages, wow.... air bags didn't even deploy I do not recall my accident to be so severe.

 

[Clock]

Kind of diminishes my hopes of a DWAI and more of a reality check. *sigh*

Just got off the phone with my insurance adjuster, $8800 in damages, wow.... air bags didn't even deploy I do not recall my accident to be so severe.

Nope, look at the verbage: You can't plead out of an alcohol violation. A DWAI is STILL an alcohol violation, and thus you can still plead to that if offered. Still all-in-all a sweet deal IF YOU GET IT since it's just a traffic infraction (albeit one with very stiff penalties).

So, like I said before, don't get your hopes too high of getting it, but it is NOT out of reach.

Good luck with the new lawyer - her previous experience will hopefully help you out!

I had the same experience with my insurance - damages were something like six grand, airbags didn't deploy, didn't look too bad. The problem is taking damage in the front of the car. There's all sorts of important stuff up there, whereas getting hit just about anywhere else isn't a big deal because you're just replacing paneling and whatnot.

 

[regrettingit]

Nope, look at the verbage: You can't plead out of an alcohol violation. A DWAI is STILL an alcohol violation, and thus you can still plead to that if offered. Still all-in-all a sweet deal IF YOU GET IT since it's just a traffic infraction (albeit one with very stiff penalties).

So, like I said before, don't get your hopes too high of getting it, but it is NOT out of reach.

Good luck with the new lawyer - her previous experience will hopefully help you out!

I had the same experience with my insurance - damages were something like six grand, airbags didn't deploy, didn't look too bad. The problem is taking damage in the front of the car. There's all sorts of important stuff up there, whereas getting hit just about anywhere else isn't a big deal because you're just replacing paneling and whatnot.

Hello Clock,
Your post has been most helpful for me. I was also arrested for DWI in western new york some days ago. I am also a 26 yr old guy and I blew .16 in the chemical test. There were no accidents when I was pulled over. The cop said he pulled me over because I braked too hard at a red light and missed the stop line by a couple of feet. Thats all that it took. I have been regretting this mistake since that day. I have no prior arrests, I did not even have a single traffic violation on my record! I absolutely cannot afford to have a criminal record on my name. So here are some of questions for you.
At the arraignment when you got your conditional license, did you need the SR-22 from the insurance company then and there itself? How much did your insurance rate go up by once Geico found out? Also, did they mention that once you complete the DDP you will get your license back immediately? Were you put on probation? Do you have to report to a PO regularly?
I have not yet consulted an attorney but I most likely will. I definitely want to plead down the DWI to a DWAI which means I get higher insurance rates but at least no criminal record.

Any help from you will be most useful. Thanks again!

 

[Clock]

Hello Clock,
Your post has been most helpful for me. I was also arrested for DWI in western new york some days ago. I am also a 26 yr old guy and I blew .16 in the chemical test. There were no accidents when I was pulled over. The cop said he pulled me over because I braked too hard at a red light and missed the stop line by a couple of feet. Thats all that it took. I have been regretting this mistake since that day. I have no prior arrests, I did not even have a single traffic violation on my record! I absolutely cannot afford to have a criminal record on my name. So here are some of questions for you.

Good, I'm very glad to have helped. I know much it sucks and how much you kick yourself in the ass when it first happens.

At the arraignment when you got your conditional license, did you need the SR-22 from the insurance company then and there itself?

Good news: New York is NOT an SR-22 state, so don't worry about any of that.

At the arraignment, I was granted a HARDSHIP license, which is issued by the court. This is different from the CONDITIONAL license, which is typically granted by the DMV 30 days after your license is taken (so 30 days after your arraignment). So no, I didn't have to prove that I had SR-22 or whatever. Literally we went through the arraignment process and at the end of it my lawyer presented the judge with a motion for a hardship license (it was a bunch of official looking papers). Judge looked at it while my lawyer went over the basics, and I was granted the HARDSHIP license.

How much did your insurance rate go up by once Geico found out?

Geico hasn't done anything to my insurance yet. They will. Again though... even if your insurance skyrockets, you can always raise your deductibles or go liability-only for the first year or two and then get collision back on. Supposedly the rates fall rather quickly after your DWI, but will take a long time to get back to where you were.

Also, did they mention that once you complete the DDP you will get your license back immediately?

My understanding from all the research I've done is that as long as you aren't recommended by the DDP class for further treatment, once you finish the DDP, you get your full license back as soon as you finish PROVIDED that your license was only SUSPENDED (so you pled guilty to a DWAI) instead of REVOKED (pled guilty to a DWI). If your license is revoked, you have an extra step to go through, but apparently that isn't a huge deal if you're a first time offense, whereas if you were only suspended, it's just automatically reinstated.

Were you put on probation? Do you have to report to a PO regularly?

I haven't been convicted of anything yet. My lawyer is currently filing all types of motions with the court before pre-trial. The strategy is to make the prosecution see that we are not going to just roll over and plead guilty, because many of those motions require work on the DA's part and essentially it all goes away if he offers the DWAI. So - no probation. From what I've read (and obviously your mileage may vary), probation isn't typical for a first time offense.

I have not yet consulted an attorney but I most likely will.

You DEFINITELY need to. Make the investment and do it now. It's easy once you get going, but this is not the sort of thing you do without a lawyer.

I definitely want to plead down the DWI to a DWAI which means I get higher insurance rates but at least no criminal record.

Yeah. I mean, your insurance is going to go up almost regardless, so just get past that hump and accept it. What I'm doing now is saving up money explicitly for my first year's worth of insurance. When it goes up, I hope to pay the whole year off right then and there and be done with it.

Any help from you will be most useful. Thanks again!

You bet. I check this every day, so if you have any more questions then let me know and I may be able to help.

 

[regrettingit]

Thanks a lot for your replies! And good luck for your next court date.

 

[Clock]

Thanks a lot for your replies! And good luck for your next court date.

Thanks.

One more thing I wanted to impress on you is that getting the hardship license is NOT as much of a given as I may have made it sound like. You NEED a lawyer and you NEED your lawyer to take the time to come up with a solid motion to get that hardship. Since granting your hardship needs evidence that isn't just your testimony, you need to come up with ways to prove that you actually do need the hardship. For example, I needed to prove that I was employed. I didn't want my employers to find out about this, so I made copies of very recent paystubs that had my name on it, made copies of ID cards that had my name and my employer's name on it, etc. If there isn't a bus route that goes near you, then it would probably help to get a map of all of the bus routes in the area and then put a big red dot where you are. Etc. I think you get the idea. Basically, when you go to your arraignment, you want your lawyer to have made up a nice little package explaining why you need the hardship license, PROOF of that, and then keep your fingers crossed that you get it. If you don't get that hardship license, then you can't drive, anywhere, for any reason, for at least 30 days. The funny thing is once my lawyer handed it to the judge, it literally took him about fifteen seconds to grant it for me. But I think you see what I'm getting at. Just keep in mind that the hardship is NOT easy to get, and it is NOT a given.

Anyhow, keep us all updated, I think it's pretty helpful for those who are actually in New York to see some real-world examples of how the process actually works.

And get a lawyer, now!

 

[regrettingit]

You bet. I check this every day, so if you have any more questions then let me know and I may be able to help.

Hey Clock,

I have another question for you. Maybe you or your attorney can answer this one for me. If my DWI charge is reduced to a DWAI charge (no criminal record) can the arrest record be expunged? I know that the DMV will still carry my driving record with the alcohol conviction on it, but at least the background check won't reveal an arrest.