TN Cohabitation

[stealth2]

I posted this in another thread that was closed by the time I hit Submit....

And btw, acmb... I actually do only use nicknames as a mnemonic. Like... misto is "misty fleas" in my head. You're "acme". It isn't meant as an insult.

 

[acmb05]

Then I think its safe to say it could still very well affect custody/visitation outcome. It depends on the judge and area. I don't think its safe to say it won't affect outcome at all ever. Which is what I felt you were implying. Although you felt I was implying that it always was and I didn't say that.

I looked up all that because its been years since my husband had to deal with any of those issues ( and at the time he did it was very much an issue) and I wanted to see if there were recent articles.

From the way I read it you did make it sound like every court in Tennessee frowned on it. My apologies if the way I wrote my response sounded the opposite. There are a few I am sure but in my County it really does not make a difference at all.

It matters more when the children are younger in age because it can effect a 5 year old to see his mom or dad sleeping in the same bed with someone other than the other parent.

When it comes right down to it the parents just need to use common sense some times. I have dated a few different woman since my separation/divorce, only one has met any of my children and never have I had someone at my house.

 

[acmb05]

I posted this in another thread that was closed by the time I hit Submit....

And btw, acmb... I actually do only use nicknames as a mnemonic. Like... misto is "misty fleas" in my head. You're "acme". It isn't meant as an insult.

We just had a slight disagreement Stealth2. My apologies if I was rude to you or anyone else.

 

[sometwo]

hen it comes right down to it the parents just need to use common sense some times

That would be great if parents actually did that. Heck we wouldn't have the courts backed up if parents did that. Life would be so much easier for everyone especially the children if that were the case.

However its not like that unfortunately .

 

[stealth2]

We just had a slight disagreement Stealth2. My apologies if I was rude to you or anyone else.

S'all okay. No hard feelings. And know if I use acme, it's not to be insulting.

 

[acmb05]

Hey btw Stealth2 Those two quotes I have were never put on here by anyone else and the only way I knew to quote them was to put my name in the box.

 

[acmb05]

That would be great if parents actually did that. Heck we wouldn't have the courts backed up if parents did that. Life would be so much easier for everyone especially the children if that were the case.

However its not like that unfortunately .

I know. My ex and I get along better now than when we were married. She even stays here at times to spend more time with the kids (her boyfriend hates it when she does)

We actually have a no paramour clause in our divorce papers although I guess technically we are breaking that clause when she stays here.

 

[stealth2]

Hey btw Stealth2 Those two quotes I have were never put on here by anyone else and the only way I knew to quote them was to put my name in the box.

Why did you need to quote them? You just put them in your sig line. Like I did.

 

[acmb05]

Why did you need to quote them? You just put them in your sig line. Like I did.

I have no idea. Just the way I did it. Yours are kinda hard to read like that. I like em when they jump out at ya.

 

[acmb05]

this better? lol

 

[neopandora]

Sometwo, I'm certainly not a senior member, but am in TN and it does read to me that in the particular case you have referenced, the Court had more of a problem with the 18 year old rather than solely on the issue of cohabitation.

Also this came from http://www.tsc.state.tn.us/geninfo/courts/localrules/28Local/RULES OF CHANCERY COURT 7-30-2009.pdf



Committee and other knowledgeable persons, finalized the form that can be found on the A. O. C. website at Tennessee Administrative Office of the Courts (under PROGRAMS) or copies of the Parenting Plan may be obtained from the Clerk’s offices. This court shall require under “J. OTHER” on the Parenting Plan, the following provisions:
“Any paramour of either parent to whom a parent is not legally married is not to spend the night in the presence of or in the same residence with any minor child of the parties. The parents shall not use any illegal drugs, consume any alcohol or allow any other person to use any illegal drugs or alcohol in the presence of the minor children.”

you can find that parenting plan here Untitled Document


There also seems to have been more recent cases on this issue


The AOC form is consistent with Rule 23:00 of the
Rules of Chancery Court for the 28th Judicial District ("Local
Rule 23"), which requires inclusion of the paramour provision
in the AOC permanent parenting plan form.

this from a case that was actually appealed this year

http://www.tsc.state.tn.us/OPINIONS/TCA/PDF/102/Joseph Marion Barker v.Angel Chandler OPN.pdf



If I'm reading it right it looks like they are supposed to now put the no paramour order in the parenting plans.

However the court just appealed that this year from the looks of it. So does that mean the higher court is saying it doesn't need to be in there but the other courts are saying it does?

What you have quoted is local rules of the 28th Judicial District (28th is Crockett, Gibson & Haywood Counties). It appears that Judicial District does require a no paramour in it's parenting plan. I've not been in any proceedings in that Judicial District so I can't tell you how well it is enforced.

Each Judicial District (and I think there's 31 in the state) have their own sets of local rules and they are all very different. If you read them all, you'll find they are very, very different on all sorts of things. Example: Knox County (6th district I believe) has a clause that if you smoke in the house, they will assume you don't take of your kids and is a big negative in custody.

It's not in the judicial district I am present in or any of the surrounding judicial districts nor do they care unless the person you live with is not of good character. In the 21st judicial district, though not in the rules and 3 counties could care less, it WILL matter in Williamson County.

As to the case you are posting, my district doesn't care about cohabitation, but we had a similar case where the Court DID care that Dad (in his 40s) brought in a barely 18 year old to live with him (who had already lost her license due to underage consumption charges) to help be a mother figure to his teenage children.


Also - we generally put the no illegal substances in our parenting plans too, but kinda chuckle when we do because illegal substances are, well.....illegal. It's kinda like putting in no one will rob a bank in the presence of the child. It doesn't make it more illegal just because it's in a parenting plan.

 

[sometwo]

What you have quoted is local rules of the 28th Judicial District (28th is Crockett, Gibson & Haywood Counties). It appears that Judicial District does require a no paramour in it's parenting plan. I've not been in any proceedings in that Judicial District so I can't tell you how well it is enforced.

my husband's court case was not in those counties either and there was not a no paramour order in the papers however his lawyer told us that we would be in trouble if we did cohabit . It was also used against the mother in her other son's case , so much in fact that mom walked out of the courtroom one day, went to the courthouse and got married.

The counselor for my stepson also told mother if she didn't stop living with her boyfriend she could be in a lot of trouble. He told her he had seen kids taken away from parents because of it. This was a few years back though and things could have changed some .

 

[neopandora]

my husband's court case was not in those counties either and there was not a no paramour order in the papers however his lawyer told us that we would be in trouble if we did cohabit . It was also used against the mother in her other son's case , so much in fact that mom walked out of the courtroom one day, went to the courthouse and got married.

The counselor for my stepson also told mother if she didn't stop living with her boyfriend she could be in a lot of trouble. He told her he had seen kids taken away from parents because of it. This was a few years back though and things could have changed some .

All districts (and sometimes counties) have their own set of written rules (and sometimes unwritten rules). Much like smoking in Knox County - anything can matter but that doesn't make it true for the whole state. Always listen to your attorney though - he knows your particular climate the best.

I only know/have experience with about 16 counties (4 to 5 judicial districts) in TN and a couple of the 5 senior judges, but none of them (excepting Williamson Co) care about cohabitation solely - assuming the paramour is a decent person and stability is not an issue.

There's nothing statutory that precludes it at all. In fact, I could think of 5 or 6 cases off the top of my head that if that was an instant custody factor would swing things the other way - but all things being equal cohabitation doesn't matter.

I