TinkerBelleLuvr
Senior Member
Children should never be given choices. The JUDGE decides, not a child.
Sounds like you said he could go, and now you are going back on your word. Terribly confusing for a child.
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Confused and Need Help...
- Thread starter passionatemom10
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Sounds like you said he could go, and now you are going back on your word. Terribly confusing for a child.
Amarillo Globe-News: Features and Lifestyles: Affirmative Parenting: As a last resort, 'kick child out of the Garden of Eden' 04/30/02
the Garden of Eden approach is for a parent who is willing to stand strong. this is a long term form of discipline. but as silver said, it may not be applicable in your situation. it really doesn't work well if both parents aren't in this together.
passionatemom10
Member
No we don't even agree on discipline at all. His dad believes that he should not be punished. His father is very permissive. I, on the other hand, believe the crime should fit the punishment.
Yes he is a child but he is also 12 and at this age when I try to punish him I can only do so much and if nothing I do bothers him it makes it that much more difficult. He is as big as I am and I can't physically make him do anything. I never said he could go so no I have not gone back on my word. You took things out of context I was actually asking if I should do this. In the end the final decision would be given by a judge I was just thinking that it could help to let him have some kind of say so in it. I am only trying to be fair with him and not go totally insane.
Thank you for explaining the GoE thing. Although I would greatly appreciate a little more detail or anything else you might could offer. Trust me I feel like I have tried everything and nothing is working.
Yes he is a child but he is also 12 and at this age when I try to punish him I can only do so much and if nothing I do bothers him it makes it that much more difficult. He is as big as I am and I can't physically make him do anything. I never said he could go so no I have not gone back on my word. You took things out of context I was actually asking if I should do this. In the end the final decision would be given by a judge I was just thinking that it could help to let him have some kind of say so in it. I am only trying to be fair with him and not go totally insane.
Thank you for explaining the GoE thing. Although I would greatly appreciate a little more detail or anything else you might could offer. Trust me I feel like I have tried everything and nothing is working.
Here you state that you DID tell son that he could go?
passionatemom10
Member
You are right I am sorry. I did tell him that I would allow him to go and stay with his dad for a while once all the custody stuff was over. I am thinking about letting him go now and I have not told him that now. I misunderstood. I do not think this is confusing to him. I have not told him that he can't go. I have just told him he will have to wait a while until the custody stuff is over.
passionatemom10
Member
oops...also just noticed the link to the GoE thing....thank you
TinkerBelleLuvr
Senior Member
Garden of Eden. They have NOTHING in their room but their bed, bedding and school clothes. They must earn everything back with good behaviours.
Why would you even be talking to him about an ADULT issue? This could be WHY he is acting out!
You may also want to check to see if your insurance company offers telephone counseling. Sometimes pre- to younger teens are more comfortable sitting in their room, on their phone and not being face to face. Couldn't hurt to ask and if it is not offered, you can always interview some counselors to see if any of them would be comfortable with that mode.
passionatemom10
Member
I am talking to him about these things because I have to respond to the mess that his dad fills his head with. I have tried keeping things from him and have sheltered him from the other things his dad has put him through which has gotten me where I am now. Such as when his dad was supposed to pick him up and he wouldn't show up and then his dad would tell him that I wouldn't let him come when in all actuality was a bit true because he would call and be drunk and what mother in their right mind would let their child get in the car with anyone driving drunk? So in essence he was not lying because I have sole custody and have had for 11 years and yes I did say he couldn't come and get him. So I took the blame for the idiotic things he was doing. My son is 12 now not 4 or 5. He is not stupid. I do not treat him as an adult but some things are discussed with him. I don't think this is why he is acting out. The reason he is acting out is because he wants his way.
I plan to read more on this GoE thing. I don't know if it will work but I am willing to try anything which is why I came here in the first place.
I plan to read more on this GoE thing. I don't know if it will work but I am willing to try anything which is why I came here in the first place.
wileybunch
Senior Member
I don't know enough about your situation, but I think the Garden of Eden approach would not be a good choice for you AT ALL. You cannot use that method under these circumstances and not expect it to backfire. GO TO COUNSELING. You do not need to take him 2-3x a week. In fact, if you ever did, he probably dislikes you for doing that! Once a week in the beginning if even that should be sufficient unless there's something going on that the counselor thinks is particularly dangerous or something like that. The child should not be made to feel they are abnormal or whatever. The child should know you love them and you want there to be more peace, cooperation, etc. You should not be in sessions with your child unless the counselor requests you to be there or you have spoken to counselor about wanting a joint session. Child should feel totally safe to talk to counselor about whatever he might want to talk about. You need separate sessions with the counselor. If you've ever messed up with your son and he's holding animosity toward you for it, clear that up.
I'm not saying Dad's right and you're wrong, but I wanted to point out where you said dad is "permissive" and you handle things as the punishment that fits the crime as though your way is the only way and I just have to say -- even in families where Mom and Dad BOTH believe in consequences, they don't always agree on the "right" consequence or how heavy or light to come down on a child for a particular offense so I think maybe you should examine your methods b/c you came off a little arrogant in that department.
I'm not saying Dad's right and you're wrong, but I wanted to point out where you said dad is "permissive" and you handle things as the punishment that fits the crime as though your way is the only way and I just have to say -- even in families where Mom and Dad BOTH believe in consequences, they don't always agree on the "right" consequence or how heavy or light to come down on a child for a particular offense so I think maybe you should examine your methods b/c you came off a little arrogant in that department.
Silverplum
Senior Member
I advise against GoE in your situation. There's no basis for it. From what I can see, your son is not of vile nature, nor is he into drugs or other criminal activity. So why should he be stripped of his belongings and treated like a criminal in his home?
Doesn't take a PhD to figure out that the GoE will push him faster and further away.
I do, however, advise you to read 3 different parenting books, ASAP.
Learn how to effectively parent now, before it's completely too late.
passionatemom10
Member
Thank you for your advice Wiley. It is greatly appreciated. I guess I did come off a bit arrogant and did not mean it in that way. I really just want what is best for my child. I have worked hard to guide him and teach him to be respectable and it is all blowing up in my face. It is very difficult when I have spent a decade teaching him right from wrong only to have his father tell him everything I am doing is wrong. The issue I am trying to get a resolution to is at this juncture should I let him go ahead and go live with his dad temporarily and let him see what living with his dad is like. It is hard for me to even fathom letting him go over there when his dad and I do not see eye to eye on anything. My son desperately wants to go live with him and it hurts deeply but if that is what he wants to do I am willing to let him go. I just need to know if it will hurt my custody case since I am having to fight the battle by myself. I do not and cannot afford legal representation. I do not want to lose custody of my son and at this point his dad cannot prove a change in custody to be beneficial to my sons well being. He has nothing he can prove to the courts. I want to give my son the opportunity and will give him that opportunity if custody does not change when all is said and done. I just need to know how it will affect the outcome of the custody case if I choose to let him do it now instead of waiting until all this mess is over.
I would not let him go, unless you are prepared for him to go FOREVER.
Explain it like this -
Son, there is a court order in place. You know that judge who sits up on the bench and throws books at people? He says you live here. I'm not willing to discuss the details of it, but the judge has decided you remain here and not with dad. We do not go against the judge's decision because we could end up in jail. So, what can we do to make it so you and I can live in peace here?
Open up a dialogue into what your rules are and why. Talk to the kiddo. Like a human. and not angry, but a real heart to heart.
Explain it like this -
Son, there is a court order in place. You know that judge who sits up on the bench and throws books at people? He says you live here. I'm not willing to discuss the details of it, but the judge has decided you remain here and not with dad. We do not go against the judge's decision because we could end up in jail. So, what can we do to make it so you and I can live in peace here?
Open up a dialogue into what your rules are and why. Talk to the kiddo. Like a human. and not angry, but a real heart to heart.
passionatemom10
Member
Thank you for that response that is what I was looking for and answer to the original question. I will have to find a way to deal with his behavior and grades and all the crap that his dad fills his head with. As a mother it is very painful to see your child hurt. I only want what is best for him. This is all breaking my heart. If his dad truly had his best interest at heart then I would not be in this situation. His dad does not realize what he is putting my child and myself through and could care less. He just wants to see me in pain. I just wish there was more that I could do. A son needs his dad to be there and I know that. I will look into another counselor for him. Thank you all for the responses you have given. They will all be taken very seriously. If anyone has any other advice I will be glad to take it into consideration.