custody question

[wonkothesane]

What is the name of your state? Florida (and Illinois)

Okay, here's the sich:

Ex wife and I have joint custody (awarded in Illinois) but I now live in Florida. (But I travel to Illinois *alot*, and stay there for weeks, even onths at a time. I lived there *all* of last year.)

I'm supposed to have the kids on weekends (all except the 3rd weekend) and summers to be decided between us. Last month my ex gave me my youngest daughter to take back here to Florida with me untill the 1st of May if possible, *or* June 1st if not.

Now she calls me up and says she will be here saturday and I have to turn my daughter over to her.

But I just realized - it's the *4th* weekend of the month. It's *my* weekend to have her! She *can't* just storm down here and demand her back, on one of my visitation weekends, can she?

It's confusing because we *aren't* in Illinois, but Florida...but she *gave* me the child to keep at least until May 1st. Signed a paper and everything. (But it wasn't anything legal.) And the custody agreement *still* gives me this weekend. It's *still* in effect.

But that still leaves monday...I can't stop my ex from taking her then, can I???

Damn.

- bryce
microgravitas@gmail.org

 

[snostar]

It depends, what exactly does the order state in regards to where visitation will occur?

 

[wonkothesane]

It depends, what exactly does the order state in regards to where visitation will occur?

Basically, it says that the "father's residence" Or "place of residence"...

This *is* my place of residence.

 

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state? Florida (and Illinois)

Okay, here's the sich:

Ex wife and I have joint custody (awarded in Illinois) but I now live in Florida. (But I travel to Illinois *alot*, and stay there for weeks, even onths at a time. I lived there *all* of last year.)

I'm supposed to have the kids on weekends (all except the 3rd weekend) and summers to be decided between us. Last month my ex gave me my youngest daughter to take back here to Florida with me untill the 1st of May if possible, *or* June 1st if not.

Now she calls me up and says she will be here saturday and I have to turn my daughter over to her.

But I just realized - it's the *4th* weekend of the month. It's *my* weekend to have her! She *can't* just storm down here and demand her back, on one of my visitation weekends, can she?

It's confusing because we *aren't* in Illinois, but Florida...but she *gave* me the child to keep at least until May 1st. Signed a paper and everything. (But it wasn't anything legal.) And the custody agreement *still* gives me this weekend. It's *still* in effect.

But that still leaves monday...I can't stop my ex from taking her then, can I???

Damn.

- bryce
microgravitas@gmail.org

You have had your daughter for a lot of extra time....I think you would have a hard time proving "contempt" in this particular situation. In fact, if mom works and is driving to pick up the child its completely sensible that she would need to pick up the child on Saturday. I think you could end up looking like a jerk to the judge if you denied mom the right to pick up the child on a day that is sensible for driving back to IL.....particularly when you have just had a great deal of extra time with the child.

 

[wonkothesane]

You have had your daughter for a lot of extra time....I think you would have a hard time proving "contempt" in this particular situation. In fact, if mom works and is driving to pick up the child its completely sensible that she would need to pick up the child on Saturday. I think you could end up looking like a jerk to the judge if you denied mom the right to pick up the child on a day that is sensible for driving back to IL.....particularly when you have just had a great deal of extra time with the child.

The mother doesn't work. She is disabled.

And she's not driving down here, her parents are either driving her here, or her parents are comming *without* her - in which case I don't really see how I can be required to turn them over to her, they don't have custody.

(Oh, and the parent's don't work either, are retired. So *nobody* involved has commitments that require them to be anywhere by monday of anything.)

Also, when she gave me the child, she signed a paper - and stated in front of neutral witnesses, that I was to keep the child until May 1st - June 1st at the latest.

But instead she calls up *yesterday* and starts demanding the child be returned at 5pm tomorrow. (On my visitation day. I have asked her to wait untill at least Sunday - my normal time to return the child - and she just keeps repeating "I want you to have her ready by 5pm tomorrow.)

I have contacted the police already, and pretty much they told me what everyone else is telling me - that they won't get involved unless my ex has a corrt order. As of this time, they aren't aware of one, but she *could* show up with one in hand.

My plans are to make her at least wait untill 5pm *sunday* - normal pick-up time, to take the child. (Police say that if she doesn't already have a court order, she can't get one untill monday anyway.)

My question NO is, is tehre any way that I can find out *now* if she has obtained a court order already? (My ex refuses to answer this question, which is odd because *if* she has one I'd think it was in her best interest to tell me, because once I have knowledge of it, my hands are really tied. But it's alos like her to just *spring* it on me.)

I can't call the courts up there on a weekend, but I was wondering if there was *someone* I could call to find out? Like maybe to police up where she lives???

One more thing to add, it seems that she is both using the local (Illinois) Legal Aid office (so I can't, because they say they have a 'conflict of interest") *and* her parents have put an atorney on retainer for her. That *can't* be legit, can it?

She uses *so* many dirty tricks like this, and it's so frustrating NOT to be able to even fight back.

Like also, she's facing emminent eviction for a dirty house and for letting her convicted felon boyfriend live with her, despite that fact that the housing authority (she lives in HUD housing) had ordered to man off the property multiple times, and the police *warned* him not to be there. Last time I was up there he even *admitted* to the police that he lived there, and they put it on record. But do ya think she told a judge any of this when/if she got a court order? I don't.

I feel *so* trapped. She lies, cheats, bends and *breaks* the law, and nobody can ever do anything because their "hands are tied".

 

[Ron1347]

If the normal pickup time isn't until 'Sunday 5 p.m.', and it is indeed NOW 'your' legal visitation time, then NO, she cannot force the kids from you until 'Sunday 5 p.m.'. Unless, as you fear, she does in fact have some kind of 'emergency order' from the court, stateing that you 'must'. I'm betting that she doesn't. I'd simply tell her, the kids stay with you until Sunday 5 p.m., unless she 'shows' you legal documentation to the contrary. 'I', wouldn't let it rattle me so much. I'm just not one to bend to hollow threats until I 'see' the proof. If she does in fact show up with an order to get the kids 'right then', then so-be-it, hand them over. Just sounds pretty 'simple' to me.

 

[LdiJ]

I understand that you were hoping to keep your child until at least May 1st, and you are disappointed that she is picking up the child early. I also understand your concerns.

However...you are being petty in my opinion for insisting that she not take the child until Sunday.

If this time you had with the child was...say....your spring break visit, and she wanted to pick the child up early (and had no place she had to be on Monday) then I would agree with you 100%. Keep the child until Sunday.

However that isn't the case. She has let you have a considerable amount of extra time with the child..therefore your insistance is petty....AND will cause extra expense for mom and her parents.

She is probably not going to give you extra time with the child again if you push this issue. Is that what you want?

 

[CJane]

Ummm.... question ~ If mom is facing emminent eviction due to her house being filthy (and if she's being evicted for it, it must be FILTHY), and she's living with an ex felon, and she's exhibiting erratic behavior ~ why aren't you filing for a change in custody? Clearly she's not acting in the best interests of the children.

I'd be worrying about their living situation a LOT more than whether or not she picked the kid up a day early.

 

[LdiJ]

Ummm.... question ~ If mom is facing emminent eviction due to her house being filthy (and if she's being evicted for it, it must be FILTHY), and she's living with an ex felon, and she's exhibiting erratic behavior ~ why aren't you filing for a change in custody? Clearly she's not acting in the best interests of the children.

I'd be worrying about their living situation a LOT more than whether or not she picked the kid up a day early.

His first post to the board was about that issue....he has appeared to drop that since then. I don't know why....he may have consulted with an attorney and got shot down on the idea.

 

[wonkothesane]

I understand that you were hoping to keep your child until at least May 1st, and you are disappointed that she is picking up the child early. I also understand your concerns.

However...you are being petty in my opinion for insisting that she not take the child until Sunday.

Wiat...wait...wait...she gives me the child, promises me AND THE CHILD TO HER FACE that she can stay untill May 1st, "maybe even June!", then calls up *thursday* night and says she is on the way here already and *DEMANDS* that the child ("Emmy") be ready to leave by 5pm saturday, "or else"...and gives me no say in the matter and totally disregurads plans the child and I have made (including a cousin's birthday party this evening that she was *reallly* looking forward too and even brought a dress for and is *crting* about having to miss)....

and my very well have seeked a court order to force me to do it, *before* she even told me she was comming...

[/b][/i]...AND *I* AM BEING PETTY???[/i][/b]

I am just insisting on the sunday date because I have to put my foot down about this kind of pushing and shoveing me around. I would never call *her* up and demand my children be given to me in 48 hours *or else* - *especially* after I had promised otherwise! I would have the common decency to give her some *warning* that I was comming!

She and her family have this *history* of pulling stuff like this (and of stepping all over and even disregurading my parentaly rights and the custody agreement terms) and of throwing their weight around (and sometimes even using *physical force* and restraing orders - _always_ later dropped when they get what they want) if I put my foot down *even once* about it, *somebody* has to call me "petty".

*Sheesh!*

And after I *promised* her that if she insisted I'm make it by May 1st?

And using the excuse that she the only reason she wants the child back so so she can go to the last 2 weeks of kindergarder in her homes school "becauses she misses her classmates badly" (uh...she does, a bit, but she'd rather stay and is very unhappy about leaving) but undoubtedly it REALLY has to do with fact that her parents and sister "wen't balistic when they found out" she gave me the child...and the only reason she gave me the child is because she "wanted to get rid of me" and "knew I would have to leave" if I had her, because I was sleeping in a *car* last time I went up there, because I really didn't have the money for a visit but my ex had her phone cut off (because her bf ran up a *300* 976 sex-chat bill!)...

And because she needs to child as an excuse to help fight eviction over having a *filthy* house and people living with her that the *cops* told her must leave....and because now's she's upset that thye cut some of her food stamps and AFCD becuse the child is gone now and welfare found out (AFDC, and food stamps, btw she never uses on the children, btw...it all goes to the bf. My kids wear rags and *starve* - which is why *I* inisted/begged that the daughter come down here in the first place - so I could properly care for her - and her bf-new hubby-whatever-he-is-this-week keeps the AFDC money for himself and has taken the foodstamp card with him when he moved upstate recently

And may very well have to do with a preemptive move towards custody herself (because she is pissed that I disagreed

AND *I* AM BEING "PETTY"???

On *what* planet and by *what* standards amd *I* being petty???

If this time you had with the child was...say....your spring break visit, and she wanted to pick the child up early (and had no place she had to be on Monday) then I would agree with you 100%. Keep the child until Sunday.

No, is was the begining of my *summer* visit, one as supposed to involve *all* my kids and that she has *denied* me for years ("so sue me!" - her words) and NOW (this *one* time she allowed it) has made shorter and shorter and whittled down to one child, and now wants to end even that.

However that isn't the case. She has let you have a considerable amount of extra time with the child..therefore your insistance is petty....AND will cause extra expense for mom and her parents.

It was supposed to be a 50/50 sharing of time (to be worked out by the parents) and she has done *everthing* in her power to ensure that I have almost NO time with the children.

Er..and the extra expense is in *them* comming down here today, after *I* was to come up there May 1st on my own, at my own expense - because they demand her back *NOW*.

She is probably not going to give you extra time with the child again if you push this issue. Is that what you want?

No. I want her to realize that she has to stop pushing me around and demanding stuff - demanding stuff at the last minute - and making threats and disrequarding my legal rights and treat *me* with some equal respect and common decency.

I mean you did read my OP right? She calls up thursday, *demands* the child back in 48 hours, makes threats if I don't return her...is this "acceptable" behavour to you???

Are you perchance my ex-wife's bf/hubby is disquise. (I joke - but only partly - last month he and he brother wrote to me pretending to be a "25 year-old single female" wanting to "give me free legal advice".

...

Oh, and as for the next poster's question as to why I haven't yet sued if my kids living conditions are so bad?

Fear. I have no lawyer (but she has two - the legal aid lawyer and the one's her parents paied for) and because my family keeps putting pressure of me to do nothing, to "not rock to boat"...

And in the past, because when I have tried legal moves my ex calls or visits me, crying, and calling me "petty" and stuff, and makes *me* feel like the bad guy for standing up for my kids.

But no more. I'm not falling for *that* anymore.

 

[wonkothesane]

*sigh*

Well, the showed up. No court order. packed up her stuff - with my parents help - and pretty much pushed me around and strong armed me and took my daughter....I don't ****ing want to get into that part just yet, I'm too ****ing upset about it...they only reason I agreed is because I *demanded* 5 minutes alone with my child to ask her what *she* wanted, and she said she wasn't happy about leaving but her mommy wanted her to, so...but when talking to *me* the father was all "Look, you and X can work this all out later, etc..."

Well, he did accuse me of being "unreasonable" one time.

God I am so fracking uspet it's hard to type...anyway, my ex's dad was *pushy*, but at the same trime trying to be somewhat diplomatic.

Then my dad comes up to me as soon as they leave and says "Well, they told me that if you show up there you will be arrested."

I said "Is there a warrent out for my arrest? A restraining order?"

My dad said "No, but they took some emails you wrote to the sheriff and he says he will arrest you if you show up there?"

I ask "What emails?" because I am not aware of any threatening emails!?!?! I *know* better than to write **** like that!!!"

Anyway, emails can be forged and altered right??? It's not unlike my ex to do this...and all these aparently were print out and such of letters, *I* can fake them. Yeah, I got a bit *irate* on some emails - stupid of me - but I never threatned anyone, besides threatening to take legal action if we could work this out or if *they* tried to break the law themselves.

Can they just do this? It's a small town sherrif they went to, who's word is
the Law if you know what I mean......but my ex desn't even live in that town as far as I know...but my dad says "It doesn't matter."

And he is the sheriff of the town I have to go to to *file* for divorce in.

Oh God I don't know what to do next or who to trust and *what* to do...I so scared and upset and tired and *shaking* and angry and dear lord they can't just get away with this!!!

Somebody *please* tell me what to do next...*please*...I am so confused...I want to sue for custody but I have now been threatened with arrest if I even show up in the county where I *have* to go to file for custody in? can they just say that?

Show up here even to file for legal custody and we'll have you arrested - no restraining order, no arrest warrent, just a *threat*???

Please somebody help me...I don't know what to do next...

 

[snostar]

First, calm down and clear your head. First thing Monday morning contact an attorney in the state that has jurisdiction and speak to them about filing for custody.

 

[wonkothesane]

First, calm down and clear your head. First thing Monday morning contact an attorney in the state that has jurisdiction and speak to them about filing for custody.

I can't. I can't afford an atorney. And I can't go through legal aid because my ex already has engaged them ("conflict of interests")...

So I am screwed. Nothing I can do. They have money so they win. (And my kids lose.) It's *that* simple.

Edited to add:

Can I file for custody without physically entering the county?

Sound like right now this is what my dad was told:

If I show up in Rushville, Illinois, to file for legal custody - even if I *don't* try to conatct my wife or children, I will be arrested on the spot (my dad says that if I show up in the county that my ex lives in, which is the county next door I'll be arrsted.)

And the sheriff's dept will take their own sweet time in handeling my case.

They can't just do this can they? Just say that if you even step foot into the courthouse we will arrest you JUST FOR BEING THERE.

That's dentying me *my* rights to utliize the justice system.

 

[LdiJ]

Moving to Florida really complicated things for you. I would have all kinds of advice to offer if you still lived in the same community as your children...but you don't...and that is entirely YOUR fault.

You have a court order...mom gave you a significant amount of time with the child outside of that court order. You are now being petty (yes you are) because mom wants to take the child back earlier than you agreed/wanted it to happen....under an informal agreement.

I don't blame you for the way that you feel....I sympathize.... Nevertheless that doesn't change the cirumstances.

If you really want things to change...then MOVE YOUR BUTT BACK TO ILLINOIS...and STAY THERE.

What you have now is fixed weekend visitation which would normally be enforceable but isn't because you live in Florida. You have summer visitation that is "as agreed" which is completely UNENFORCEABLE. Your family is telling you "not to rock the boat" because they realize that you messed up by moving to FL.

If you believe that your children are living in a bad situation...then again, get your butt back to Illinois...establish a regular and consistant presence in their lives under your existing order...and then file for primary custody.

 

[snostar]

I can't. I can't afford an atorney. And I can't go through legal aid because my ex already has engaged them ("conflict of interests")...

So I am screwed. Nothing I can do. They have money so they win. (And my kids lose.) It's *that* simple.

Sure, just give up.
Ever hear the expression, "If there's a will there's a way?" Heck, I chopped off three feet of gorgeous curls and sold them just give an attorney a retainer once. And, I would do it again in a heart beat if it meant fighting for what I thought was best for my children