Dual Citizenship & Child Protection

[mls9876]

Child Protection - NEED HELP ASAP!

What is the name of your state? Ohio

I am seeking advice on any and all case laws regarding child protection from abduction.
I am the mother of a 2 month old daughter, born to myself (an American citizen) and her father (a Turkish national/American citizen).
We have signed the paternity affidavit and he is currently on her birth certificate. Since coming home from the hospital, he has threatened to abduct her and move back to Turkey. I have entered her in the Children's Passport Issuance Alert Program, which notifies me should he try to obtain a US Passport for her. My problem is that he still can file for a Turkish passport and declare her a citizen there. If I can have his name removed from her birth certificate, this would disallow him to obtain the Turkish citizenship for her and the passport. The problem is, I have signed the paternity affidavit not knowing his intentions and the only way to remove it is through a DNA test which will show she is his child, so that route is not an option.
I have spoken with the Turkish Consulate in the states (D.C. and IL) and they are saying that anything they would do to prevent this from occuring would violate his rights as a Turkish citizen. The only (possible) help they can offer is under the Hague Convention and this is after an abduction occurs. (and does not even mean Turkish law would consider it an abduction)
Currently, I have sole custody of her and am trying to obtain a restraining order due to the threats (against myself and her kidnapping). Unfortunately, this does not always prevent an international abduction. My only chance is in making sure he does not obtain the documents needed in order to leave the U.S. and relocate with her to Turkey.
Does anyone know of any cases where the courts did remove a father's name from the birth certificate although paternity had been established? Surely, there must be some case under these exigent circumstances. (she was born and resides in Ohio- he resides in Texas).
Any help at all would be appreciated!
Thank you!!

 

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state? Ohio

I am seeking advice on any and all case laws regarding child protection from abduction.
I am the mother of a 2 month old daughter, born to myself (an American citizen) and her father (a Turkish national/American citizen).
We have signed the paternity affidavit and he is currently on her birth certificate. Since coming home from the hospital, he has threatened to abduct her and move back to Turkey. I have entered her in the Children's Passport Issuance Alert Program, which notifies me should he try to obtain a US Passport for her. My problem is that he still can file for a Turkish passport and declare her a citizen there. If I can have his name removed from her birth certificate, this would disallow him to obtain the Turkish citizenship for her and the passport. The problem is, I have signed the paternity affidavit not knowing his intentions and the only way to remove it is through a DNA test which will show she is his child, so that route is not an option.
I have spoken with the Turkish Consulate in the states (D.C. and IL) and they are saying that anything they would do to prevent this from occuring would violate his rights as a Turkish citizen. The only (possible) help they can offer is under the Hague Convention and this is after an abduction occurs. (and does not even mean Turkish law would consider it an abduction)
Currently, I have sole custody of her and am trying to obtain a restraining order due to the threats (against myself and her kidnapping). Unfortunately, this does not always prevent an international abduction. My only chance is in making sure he does not obtain the documents needed in order to leave the U.S. and relocate with her to Turkey.
Does anyone know of any cases where the courts did remove a father's name from the birth certificate although paternity had been established? Surely, there must be some case under these exigent circumstances. (she was born and resides in Ohio- he resides in Texas).
Any help at all would be appreciated!
Thank you!!

Actually, there are other things that you can do. Do not allow him to be alone with her. Always make sure that you have another adult in the house with you during visitation. Do not allow him to know where she goes for daycare (if she does)...in other words, don't give him the opportunity to abduct her.

If and when he takes it to court, explain about his threats and about the research that you did to discover if it was possible to protect her against being abducted.

One thing confuses me though...when he became and American citizen he renounced his rights to Turkish citizenship (at least as far as the US is concerned). It would be interesting to know how it would be possible for him to get a Turkish passport for a child born to two American parents.

 

[mls9876]

Thank you for your help...

I appreciate your advice!!

Unfortunately, in this country (with all that's happened), he did not have to renounce his citizenship to Turkey (a very Muslim country). You'd think he would have to, but....

My problem is that 1) the court at some point may allow him to be unsupervised with her. 2) no matter how hard you try to keep an eye on them, they eventually have to go to daycare, school, babysitter, etc. and people do kidnap children. 3) it is possible for him to somehow find her daycare, etc. simply by hiring a private detective or following me himself.
He has already hired a P.I. to "prove me unfit", but to no avail. (I have no record).

My only hope is to make it legally impossible for him to leave the country with her. =(

Thank you again for you help, I really appreciate your reply!!!

 

[LdiJ]

I appreciate your advice!!

Unfortunately, in this country (with all that's happened), he did not have to renounce his citizenship to Turkey (a very Muslim country). You'd think he would have to, but....

My problem is that 1) the court at some point may allow him to be unsupervised with her. 2) no matter how hard you try to keep an eye on them, they eventually have to go to daycare, school, babysitter, etc. and people do kidnap children. 3) it is possible for him to somehow find her daycare, etc. simply by hiring a private detective or following me himself.
He has already hired a P.I. to "prove me unfit", but to no avail. (I have no record).

My only hope is to make it legally impossible for him to leave the country with her. =(

Thank you again for you help, I really appreciate your reply!!!

The US doesn't recognize dual custody for adults. When he took the oath of citizenship he renounced his Turkish citizenship...this I know for sure. Your problem is that Turkey doesn't care...and that it appears that Turkey is also willing to consider your CHILD a Turkish citizen too...since they are willing to issue her a passport.

If the Turkish government will issue a passport for her without your signature (very possible because in muslim countries the children are the property of their fathers) then I don't think that there is any way that you can guarantee that she can't be abducted....and neither can a judge for that matter. Therefore you will have to push to keep visitation supervised.

One other possible option is to ask the judge to require him to post a bond...equivalent to a very high dollar amount..so that in the event that he DID abduct her, that there would be a large amount of money available to you to hire the necessary legal experts to handle a Hague Convention case.

Do some research to present to a judge on the costs of battling an international case using the Hague Convention. There may be other options also...and attorney that is experienced in international child custody matters would be a good source for information.

Contact the US State Department too. They may very likely have some good advice for you as well. It might be possible to flag HIS passport...Turkish OR US, so that if he attempted to leave the country with a child he could be detained.

 

[SOOStressed Out]

Go to www.missingkids.com. They have information on International Child Abduction.

You can request only supervised visitation based on the threats, or if they don't grant that, then request that he relinquish his passport prior to any visitation with the child.

I am in the same boat. I NEVER put my son's father's information on ANY school or day care records Ever. Generally he does not know where he is attending day care or school for this reason. Not that he couldn't find out, but schools will not release a child to someone unless their information is on the registration card you provide to them. This is not a fail proof thing, but it does make it difficult for them to just show up and leave with your child.

When they get school age, you educate your children about the situation and what to do if something ever happens.

 

[mls9876]

citizenship

He was born here to Turkish citizens, then returned to Turkey at 3 months of age, so his dual citizenship is recognized in both countries for that reason. (he did not immigrate here).

I was informed that if he did not have the proper documentation proving she was his daughter (i.e. birth certificate with his name on it), he could not acquire citizenship in Turkey or a passport for her in Turkey.
There was a law passed in 2001 requiring both parents sign for a US passport, so that is not a problem.

And information on removal of a parent due to exigent circumstances?

 

[Anisah_H]

One thing confuses me though...when he became and American citizen he renounced his rights to Turkish citizenship (at least as far as the US is concerned). It would be interesting to know how it would be possible for him to get a Turkish passport for a child born to two American parents.

The following is from uscitizenship.info:

"The US State Department -- traditionally quite combative in its handling of dual-citizenship claims -- has changed the way it handles these cases in recent years, and it is now much easier to retain such a status without a fight than it used to be. "

"The official US State Department policy on dual citizenship today is that the United States does not favor it as a matter of policy because of various problems they feel it may cause, but the existence of dual citizenship is recognized in individual cases. That is, if you ask them if you ought to become a dual citizen, they will recommend against doing it; but if you tell them you are a dual citizen, they'll usually say it's OK. "

"There is nothing in US law forbidding a US citizen to possess both a US passport and a foreign passport -- provided, of course, that the person really is a citizen of both countries."

Just FYI. I know a lot of people who have passports from their country of birth.

Anisah in NJ

 

[nextwife]

Well, typically, when a mom comes here complaining that she doesn't want dad to have any rights, part of the response is that he IS the dad he is therefore entitled to enforce his rights through the courts. At which point mom tells us why he's a bad guy, and someone remarks that they knew, or should have known what he was like BEFORE they chose to have a baby with him.

It's not like he was neither of Turkish origin or Muslim BEFORE you chose this guy to have a baby with. He didn't suddenly change. Sorry, but I believe the courts will tread very carefully on denying a muslim father his parental rights unless there is PROOF that warrants it..

 

[mls9876]

child custody

no ma'am, i did not know he was a muslim on paper. that fact was lied to me about. there are a number of things that i was in the dark about for a long time. some people do have illnesses/problems with lying in this world.
hindsight is 20/20, not the future.
thank you for you insensitive response to the threat of my daughter's kidnapping.

 

[LdiJ]

He was born here to Turkish citizens, then returned to Turkey at 3 months of age, so his dual citizenship is recognized in both countries for that reason. (he did not immigrate here).

I was informed that if he did not have the proper documentation proving she was his daughter (i.e. birth certificate with his name on it), he could not acquire citizenship in Turkey or a passport for her in Turkey.
There was a law passed in 2001 requiring both parents sign for a US passport, so that is not a problem.

And information on removal of a parent due to exigent circumstances?

Actually, US law requires that a child born with dual citizenship make a choice at age 21. Therefore he had to make a choice at 21 whether to retain US citizenship or Turkish citizenship....however again, Turkey may not also have that requirement. So even if he made that choice under US law, Turkey may not recognize that and may allow him to retain both.

If he isn't on her birth certificate then I don't see any way that he could acquire Turkish citizenship for her or a Turkish passport....however if he takes you to court and establishes paternity that changes that....so you are right back at square one. Again, talk to an attorney who specializes in international child custody cases, and talk to someone at the state department.

 

[LdiJ]

Well, typically, when a mom comes here complaining that she doesn't want dad to have any rights, part of the response is that he IS the dad he is therefore entitled to enforce his rights through the courts. At which point mom tells us why he's a bad guy, and someone remarks that they knew, or should have known what he was like BEFORE they chose to have a baby with him.

It's not like he was neither of Turkish origin or Muslim BEFORE you chose this guy to have a baby with. He didn't suddenly change. Sorry, but I believe the courts will tread very carefully on denying a muslim father his parental rights unless there is PROOF that warrants it..

Being a flight risk IS a factor in child custody/visitation issues. This dad HAS seriously threatened to remove the child to Turkey. Mom's concerns are not unwarranted...nor would a judge consider them unwarranted.

Therefore a judge would be looking for ways to preserve dad's rights while still assuring that dad couldn't just up and remove the child to another country. Unfortunately, the judge's options are limited because dad's other country appears to not only be recognizing HIS citizenship of that country, but also his daughter's.

It has nothing to do with religion. It has to do with countries and their laws. Religion plays a role only because some countries laws are based on religion.

and now that mom has given more info...lets think about this a little more...Dad born in US to Turkish parents and was removed to Turkey at three months, but retained US citizenship. (can't happen under today's laws but did happen in the past)

Now...dad returned to the US at some point, married another American citizen and is now threatening to remove the child to Turkey.....who could grow up in Turkey and again freely return to the US....as a citizen. Both of her parents were US citizens.

Lets not let our zeal for fairness in child custody issues lead us be blind to the fact that international abductions DO happens, and that sometimes the reasons are deeper than mere parental love.

 

[mls9876]

thank you!

thank you so much for your sensitivity, i was beginning to feel that my daughter's safety was less important to people than her father's rights.
if she is removed, turkey is a muslim country where women are "owned". i would very likely not get her back.
i am trying to have him removed from her birth cert. in order to keep him from getting a turkish passport for her.
any ideas?

 

[stealth2]

The US doesn't recognize dual custody for adults. When he took the oath of citizenship he renounced his Turkish citizenship...this I know for sure.

You should check your facts before making such pronouncements, LDi. According to http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1753.html (and I would think that the State Dept would "know for sure"):

A U.S. citizen may acquire foreign citizenship by marriage, or a person naturalized as a U.S. citizen may not lose the citizenship of the country of birth. U.S. law does not mention dual nationality or require a person to choose one citizenship or another. Also, a person who is automatically granted another citizenship does not risk losing U.S. citizenship. However, a person who acquires a foreign citizenship by applying for it may lose U.S. citizenship. In order to lose U.S. citizenship, the law requires that the person must apply for the foreign citizenship voluntarily, by free choice, and with the intention to give up U.S. citizenship.

 

[stealth2]

turkey is a muslim country where women are "owned". i would very likely not get her back.

I have to address this because it is bullsh*t. Although most Turks are Moslem, 90% (if not more) are secular Moslems. Turkey itself is a secular nation AND a democracy. Women are not OWNED in Turkey, although culturally they are not on a completely level playing field. How do I know this? My sister-in-law is Turkish, and I knew her family - which includes numerous men AND women, all of whom are highly educated and the women are anything but "owned". (I've also been there numerous times.) Sure, go out to some backwoods villages and you'll find that things aren't quite so equal. But those also aren't the type of people who would be emigrating to the US. So don't go spreading stereotypes.

 

[mls9876]

Facts

I spoke with the Turkish consulate regarding Turkish law.
Women/children do NOT have the same rights as men. It was stated to me by an official of the Turkish government.
This is not about stereotypes, it is about my daughters safety.
Please do not use my issue as your soapbox. I am on this site seeking legal information regarding how to protect my daughter from being abducted to a country that has stated to me "their laws do not require her return". She is owned by her father in their eyes, in essence. To them, a court order issued by the US courts will not mean he has kidnapped her.
If you have advice, please advise. I am really not looking for a debate on whether Turkey is advanced as far as women's rights.
I need LEGAL help to protect my daughter.
Thank you!