Hostile Work Environment and Demotion Due to Employer Relations

[justalayman]

You are right that discrimination and hostility are not illegal.

By Florida definition, I don't necessarily have a case. I am not disputing that.

I suppose a better question would be, if the case has been tried and done before (in California specifically), what are the chances that I would succeed as well?

The person in said case was not blamed for discrimination, but having relations with other employees that made the general work environment hostile.

I have unpaid wages, lost responsibilities, schedule changes, and other unjust actions committed to me on behalf of this employee. I can even say the discrimination is simply because I am the only male manager.

a hostile work environment does not mean the injured employee was the target of the activity involved. It means they were exposed to such conditions the offensive activity did in fact affect them. So far you haven't even reached the point of activity that could create a hostile work environment let alone that it affected you such that you would have a claim.

What it appears we have is a situation of you being upset because the boss has allowed his "friend" to take effective control of the store. Sorry but that's not illegal discrimination. Sometimes that's just life.


Eta:

I didn't read the decision but the simple statement that it expanded he law to include those not targeted by the activity as being injured is simply not true. I can't recall offhand how long that has been included in an "injured party" such that the party not involved in the actual activity has standing to sue. Dang, the Chrysler case decades ago was based on not only that but it even roped in not only activity at work but involving activities that are employer sponsored.


Dang, decades ago there was a case in Florida where workers at a shipyard saw a nudie girl calender hanging in a workers toolbox that they happened to walk by on the way to their own works station and they won their suit.

on top of that, there have been myriad rulings where the activity involved was actually consensual between the parties but a third uninvolved party was exposed to the activity where it was ruled to be a hostile work environment.




You seem to be chasing a rabbit that has been out of the hole for a long time already.

But the rabbit has still not been to your place of employment

 

[Alpha_Wolf_]

a hostile work environment does not mean the injured employee was the target of the activity involved. It means they were exposed to such conditions the offensive activity did in fact affect them. So far you haven't even reached the point of activity that could create a hostile work environment let alone that it affected you such that you would have a claim.

What it appears we have is a situation of you being upset because the boss has allowed his "friend" to take effective control of the store. Sorry but that's not illegal discrimination. Sometimes that's just life.

There is recorded footage of the two in the store where the employer offers special treatment to this employee.

The employee herself has even disrespected the employer in front of other employees and received no appropriate response.

And I understand that California is not Florida, I was born in California and drove through every state between there to Florida.

I was mentioning the case so that everyone was aware of the reference and because although it is a different state, the case is what allowed the law to be expanded in the first place.



I am not simply upset about a friend running the store.
I am upset because I just moved a month ago, have a wedding coming up next month, and have lost wages (that I am fighting for).
Also, the harassment I receive from this employee is a direct result of her relationship with the employer, as it would not suffice or be allowed to happen otherwise. When you discipline one employee and not another (who has worse offenses), that is favoritism and gender discrimination at its finest. Being demoted for these reasons and now possibly terminated is definitely a hostile environment by the right standards.

The truth in me asking this question to begin with is for my pride and for what I believe is right. Not that what is right is always legal or what is wrong is always illegal.
I already have another job lined up, as I have vast experience in my field. That was not the point.

But I sincerely thank you all for the legal advice. This is a complicated situation that needs to be addressed by expansion upon Florida's harassment laws, but it is no way me being sensitive or upset because another employee receives special treatment.

It is when my job and reputation for other jobs are being threatened that I take action.

 

[tranquility]

The decision marks a significant expansion of sexual harassment law in California since prior cases restricted actionable harassment claims to employees who were either directly involved in sexual liaisons at the worksite or recipients of unwanted sexual advances on the job [Miller v. Department of Corrections, Cal. Sup. Ct. No. S114097 (July 18, 2005)].

Forgetting about the lack of precedent value, the key there was the pervasive set of sexual favors which rose to discrimination based on sex. You have alleged a single person. On a quick read, the case seems to specifically exclude that as a possibility.

 

[justalayman]

The employee herself has even disrespected the employer in front of other employees and received no appropriate response.



So? Not a damn thing illegal about that.


While the involved employee may have some action available, still not seeing you as having anything.

Also, the harassment I receive from this employee is a direct result of her relationship with the employer, as it would not suffice or be allowed to happen otherwise. When you discipline one employee and not another (who has worse offenses), that is favoritism and gender discrimination at its finest

Um, no.

The discrimination has nothing to do with an unlawful activity. She can treat you like crap because she is doing the boss and he overlooks it and it is not illegal discrimination nor the basis for a hostile work environment.


The different treatment is nothing unless you can prove it is based on unlawful discrimination. It would be impossible for you to do so given you were the only male in management as there will be no other situations that can support your claim. It just happens you are a male. You have nothing to show the action was taken because you are male.

 

[Alpha_Wolf_]

Forgetting about the lack of precedent value, the key there was the pervasive set of sexual favors which rose to discrimination based on sex. You have alleged a single person. On a quick read, the case seems to specifically exclude that as a possibility.

n focusing upon the question whether the sexual favoritism was coercive, the Court of Appeal overlooked the principle that even in the absence of coercive behavior, certain conduct creates a work atmosphere so demeaning to women that it constitutes an actionable hostile work environment." The high court concluded that "although an isolated instance of favoritism on the part of a supervisor toward a female employee with whom the supervisor is conducting a consensual sexual affair ordinarily would not constitute sexual harassment, when such sexual favoritism in a workplace is sufficiently widespread it may create an actionable hostile work environment in which the demeaning message is conveyed to female employees that they are viewed by management as 'sexual playthings' or that the way required for women to get ahead in the workplace is by engaging in sexual conduct with their supervisors or the management."

I will not pretend to be an expert on law, but what I gathered is that even if there is no sexual activity between parties, any relation between the two that in any way creates a discriminatory image towards genders and creates a hostile environment is grounds for legal action.

Again, I am not saying my case is as severe as this one. But if we all just sit by idly while people screw us over, nothing will change. I was definitely screwed out of a position as it was this employee that brought complaints about me to begin with as well as earned wages because this employee did my payroll incorrectly and caused me to lose almost $600.00 in wages.

 

[Zigner]

n focusing upon the question whether the sexual favoritism was coercive, the Court of Appeal overlooked the principle that even in the absence of coercive behavior, certain conduct creates a work atmosphere so demeaning to women that it constitutes an actionable hostile work environment." The high court concluded that "although an isolated instance of favoritism on the part of a supervisor toward a female employee with whom the supervisor is conducting a consensual sexual affair ordinarily would not constitute sexual harassment, when such sexual favoritism in a workplace is sufficiently widespread it may create an actionable hostile work environment in which the demeaning message is conveyed to female employees that they are viewed by management as 'sexual playthings' or that the way required for women to get ahead in the workplace is by engaging in sexual conduct with their supervisors or the management."

I will not pretend to be an expert on law, but what I gathered is that even if there is no sexual activity between parties, any relation between the two that in any way creates a discriminatory image towards genders and creates a hostile environment is grounds for legal action.

Again, I am not saying my case is as severe as this one. But if we all just sit by idly while people screw us over, nothing will change. I was definitely screwed out of a position as it was this employee that brought complaints about me to begin with as well as earned wages because this employee did my payroll incorrectly and caused me to lose almost $600.00 in wages.

If your payroll was done incorrectly, ask that it be corrected. A clerical error doesn't mean you were discriminated against.

 

[Alpha_Wolf_]

Dang, decades ago there was a case in Florida where workers at a shipyard saw a nudie girl calender hanging in a workers toolbox that they happened to walk by on the way to their own works station and they won their suit.

Well look at that. That's crazy.

If it's that easy, maybe I'm looking at the wrong job!

A position I had prior had the creepiest old man that would hit on all the female employees and make suggestive comments all the time.

 

[justalayman]

but it is no way me being sensitive or upset because another employee receives special treatment.


Bull puckey. Every statement you have made has been based on exactly that. You are simply trying to find some legal basis to claim it was illegal. Sorry dude but so far you lose.

 

[justalayman]

Well look at that. That's crazy.

If it's that easy, maybe I'm looking at the wrong job!

A position I had prior had the creepiest old man that would hit on all the female employees and make suggestive comments all the time.

And guess what; that quite likely was actionable by you.


I can't even tell dirty jokes at work to people that have similar proclivities due to the concern of them being overheard by another person not even part of the conversation. That has been determined to be unlawful years ago.

 

[Alpha_Wolf_]

And guess what; that quite likely was actionable by you.


I can't even tell dirty jokes at work to people that have similar proclivities due to the concern of them being overheard by another person not even part of the conversation. That has been determined to be unlawful years ago.

Yeah but, creepy as it was, he was actually fairly nice and I don't look for things like that.

To give you a glimpse of the person I am, that this was not based on sensitivity, maybe you should know that I was crushed between two vehicles and had my femur broken. I then had surgery and now have a titanium rod in my bone.

I did not sue.

I'm not the person that looks for stupid lawsuits. But, I do bite back when people try to harm me (and my fiancee whom I support).

That is all.

I was looking for legal advice, and as we are all just people behind a computer screen, I don't expect people to know me or care. But putting it out there anyway.

As I said before, I sincerely thank you all for the advice. I already acknowledged the difficulty I would have in pursuing something like this and was already well aware of all the information provided.

You can't blame a person for trying to brainstorm with others and get what they rightfully deserve! Law or no law. People suck.

 

[justalayman]

Dang dude, my wife died on the operating table (subsequently revived) due to medical error and she nor I even considered suing. Life happens. While you now try to tell me how nice you are, your post here argues just the opposite. People are legally allowed to be *******s. If they boss allows it, oh well. You need either learn to accept working with an ******* or plan on finding another job.





Nothing you have stated supports any unlawful activity which you have a basis to act on.

 

[commentator]

The Florida of today is so far removed from even the Florida of a few years ago that it is the antithesis of California or any other liberal state, and is quite possibly the least employee friendly state in the union. Good luck with any lawsuit in the situation you describe. There is just no hostile workplace lawsuit anywhere that I am seeing in all this hodgepodge of he said/she said/I said. It is obvious you are seriously overinvolved in your workplace drama and are trying to read case law from long ago and far away to figure out how you can make 'em pay. Your only hope in this tactic is that your employer may also be ignorant of the workplace laws that are actually in effect, and will be bluffed by your surety that you will take them to court and sue their back teeth out. And even then, you are not going to be able to make this mess into a good place to work or make them treat you fairly.

If you quit your job and file a lawsuit, or are fired from your job in the circumstances you describe, my strong suspicion is that no only do you not have a "hostile workplace" lawsuit, or a "retaliation" lawsuit or any EEOC case, in short no lawsuit, you wouldn't even have a good chance of being approved for unemployment benefits.

You are in an at-will state, where they can fire you anytime for any reason, there is nothing in labor law that says they can't treat you unfairly, or discriminate between you and another employee or pretty much do anything they want to you. If they fire you and do not want you to get unemployment benefits, they must show that they had a valid misconduct work related reason to terminate you. Refusing to cooperate in various ways is risky for your chances.

Quitting means that to get unemployment, you'd have to show that you had a valid serious work related reason for your termination, and that tried to resolve the problem and had exhausted all reasonable means of doing so.

And in Florida today, I'd say your only recourse is start looking now and to find a job you like better with better people before you leave this one, or to file for unemployment benefits while looking for another job (if you are forced to leave, fired,) and not expect much as to the likelihood of being approved for the princely sum of no more than $275 a week for a few weeks.

 

[Alpha_Wolf_]

Dang dude, my wife died on the operating table (subsequently revived) due to medical error and she nor I even considered suing. Life happens. While you now try to tell me how nice you are, your post here argues just the opposite. People are legally allowed to be *******s. If they boss allows it, oh well. You need either learn to accept working with an ******* or plan on finding another job.





Nothing you have stated supports any unlawful activity which you have a basis to act on.

I feel like we're getting the same message across now lol . . .

Yes, I said I'm a nice guy. Yes, I looked into possible legal action I can pursue with, on a forum. I didn't get a lawyer or beat the girl up.

I just looked into my options with others.

I understand and accept that people are terrible and will lead others into situations like this.

Don't see how these posts make me "malicious" or "not nice".

If I did have a case everyone would have responded differently. Doesn't change the fact that what happened to me was unfair, everything being said is entirely false.

 

[Alpha_Wolf_]

The Florida of today is so far removed from even the Florida of a few years ago that it is the antithesis of California or any other liberal state, and is quite possibly the least employee friendly state in the union. Good luck with any lawsuit in the situation you describe. There is just no hostile workplace lawsuit anywhere that I am seeing in all this hodgepodge of he said/she said/I said. It is obvious you are seriously overinvolved in your workplace drama and are trying to read case law from long ago and far away to figure out how you can make 'em pay. Your only hope in this tactic is that your employer may also be ignorant of the workplace laws that are actually in effect, and will be bluffed by your surety that you will take them to court and sue their back teeth out. And even then, you are not going to be able to make this mess into a good place to work or make them treat you fairly.

If you quit your job and file a lawsuit, or are fired from your job in the circumstances you describe, my strong suspicion is that no only do you not have a "hostile workplace" lawsuit, or a "retaliation" lawsuit or any EEOC case, in short no lawsuit, you wouldn't even have a good chance of being approved for unemployment benefits.

You are in an at-will state, where they can fire you anytime for any reason, there is nothing in labor law that says they can't treat you unfairly, or discriminate between you and another employee or pretty much do anything they want to you. If they fire you and do not want you to get unemployment benefits, they must show that they had a valid misconduct work related reason to terminate you. Refusing to cooperate in various ways is risky for your chances.

Quitting means that to get unemployment, you'd have to show that you had a valid serious work related reason for your termination, and that tried to resolve the problem and had exhausted all reasonable means of doing so.

And in Florida today, I'd say your only recourse is start looking now and to find a job you like better with better people before you leave this one, or to file for unemployment benefits while looking for another job (if you are forced to leave, fired,) and not expect much as to the likelihood of being approved for the princely sum of no more than $275 a week for a few weeks.

I am well aware of Florida's employment laws and have already been given advice from other users here on the matter.

As far as unemployment, I already have another job interview and would never be without work long enough to benefit from unemployment (not to mention unemployment is not feasible to live off of).

Thank you though!

 

[cbg]

Just to make it clear:

1.) California law cuts no ice anywhere but California. It does not matter a darn what California law would say if you are in Florida.

2.) You have described nothing that would give you legal recourse in California, let alone Florida.