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Me and my children need help!

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Ciarraine

Member
ATaylor said:
I moved in with all six children. The landlord knew I had 6, and all six are on the lease. It is a four bedroom townhouse apartment. So it is not overcrowded by any means. 2 children to each room, and one for my husband and I. The children are still locked up in the house for now. I am scared to let them play out front. We try to go to the park when possible on weekends. I am thankfull it is dark early now, so they don't really miss playing outside. I just wanted to know if the landlord can legally say where my children are allowed to play? Can anyone answer this for me?
Yes, the landlord can restrict recreational activities to designated areas. Where are they playing now? If "out front" means an area used for parking, that could be why.

Landlords have people telling them where kids can and can't play. They're called "property insurance adjustors" and "law enforcement." Try to understand the problem from the landlord's perspective.
 


ATaylor

Junior Member
How dare you say that. I came to this forum for help with a question about my landlord. Who are you to judge. I wanted and planned ALL my children. But I do not plan to have anymore and made sure that I could not have anymore. That was very rude.

But thank you very much for the replys that WERE helpfull.
 

wendakins

Junior Member
Last I knew this was a free country and we have rights to protect us. I think it is very unfair that because you have 6 children there are people ready to criticize you on the assumption that with so many of them they must be unruly. Even though your lease was up at the end of the first year that lease is still the contract that you follow. Read the lease and see if there is anything there that indicates that you must only use your backyard or the field behind the complex. If not then there is nothing they can do to punish you. However, if there is something in the lease then you need to be on top of your community and over inforce their own rule. I'm sure that other neighborhood children wonder around. Bring this to their attention EVERY TIME! Become the whistle blower. Make sure you have documentation that you filed a complaint. They have been on your case so perhaps it's time to reverse the rolls. I do have a few questions however, Do you ever visit any of your neighbors? I was wondering this because if you do, would that make you in violation seeing as you are only allowed to "play" in your own backyard. Are your neighbors complaining that your kids are in their yard? If they are, then ask to see the complaints so you know exactly what the problem is, who has the problem and what they want to be done to correct it. As for them harrassing you about your "herd", it is illegal to harrass and even more so if based on race, creed, religion etc. Call the police and have a complaint signed immediately and continue to do so in case they try to evict you for some inconsequential reason. Then you will have the proof you need that it is a prejudice against you whereas they have no grounds for removal. Be prepared though. Some police agencies do not like to do paperwork. Stand firm and file those complaints. You shouldn't have to feel like a threatened prisoner in your own home. Good Luck!

PS In the meantime you may want to look for another place to live, unfair yes but the piece of mind it will give you is a reward in and of itself.
 

wendakins

Junior Member
I feel that some of the respondants to this issue are being very rude. Perhaps your parents should have taken your advice? :)
 

ATaylor

Junior Member
Excellent point made. I do visit some of my neighbors, and other children are always wondering around the apartment complex. I am not the only one in the community with children, but I still think she targets my family more. I think I have figured out that it is because of the fact that I live in front of the office. I often wonder if the landlord does not want future tennants to see a bunch of children running around. I have read over my lease and there is not a single word about where children should and should not play. But there was a comment made that it may be because of where. The front of my aparment is also a parking area. But every square inch of area in the complex is a parking area. There is no play ground. There is a swimming pool area, but they are not allowed around there either for obvious reasons. The last comment was right. I will start looking for a new home and as soon as the lease is up I am out!

By the way, it makes no difference if you have one child, two children or six, Like me. They are your children, and if you think they are being "picked on", or treated badly you do something about it. My choices may not be your choices, but the choices I made are mine, and I love my life and my family. In the future, the people who were aparently so surprised at the number of children I have should put your self in my shoes for a moment. And think about your one or two children constantly being harrassed by your landlord, being blamed for things you didn't do, told you cant jump rope, ride your bike, or throw a ball. Tell me what you would do?
 

ttepper2085

Junior Member
LL cant keep kids from playing , only if injury imminent

Can my landlord require me to supervise my children when they are outside?

No. The law doesn't allow a landlord to require children to be supervised when outside unless it there is a compelling reason to justify such. A "compelling reason" is not something trivial such as the landlord’s desire for peace and quiet. Rather, a compelling reason is something that likely posed imminent danger to the child if the child wasn’t supervised, such as requiring supervision of young kids in a pool. In this situation, there is a very present danger. Otherwise, the landlord cannot require supervision of kids because he doesn’t want kids running around unattended. A parent is free to allow their children to play outside unsupervised even if the landlord doesn’t think this is good parenting. With this in mind, it is illegal for a landlord to require children to be supervised while playing in the common areas because a young child "might" wonder off or fall and hurt themselves. Unless the danger is clearly real and obvious, then a landlord cannot require supervision of a child. A landlord's fear of "liability" or concern that a child might get hurt if unsupervised is not legal grounds to permit him to require tenants to supervise their children. The landlord must leave such decisions to the parent. As one court has noted, "Safety judgments are for informed parents to make, not landlords."

(Back to questions)

Does a landlord’s concern over liability or fear of getting sued, allow a landlord to require children to be supervised?
No. Neither is a legitimate reason to require supervision. Every business in the country is fearful of these two things, but that does not mean that it can run roughshod over a person’s legal rights. By the same token, federal and state fair housing laws expressly protect the rights of families and children to be free from discrimination against children. By law, children are allowed to play outside just so long as there isn’t a compelling reason that would require supervision. A landlord’s personal fear of liability does not qualify as a compelling reason that would allow him to usurp a family’s federal and state fair housing rights. A compelling reason usually deals with a true, dangerous situation if the child is left alone, such as small children swimming in a pool unattended. If the landlord truly has a legitimate safety concern that he is trying to address, then he must take careful precautions to narrowly tailor a rule that will deal very specifically with a limited problem. For example, if the landlord is worried about young children drowning in the pool, then it is perfectly okay to have a rule that says, "Children under 14 must be supervised while swimming." However, the landlord goes too far if, in an effort to solve this problem, he creates a rule that says, "No children are allowed to play outside at anytime." Yes, this would also solve the problem, but the rule is too broad.

(back to questions)

Can a landlord refuse to allow children to play with toys or play outside because he is worried about liability or is fearful of getting sued?
No. By law, children are allowed to play outside unless there is a compelling reason to prohibit it, such as there being a real and present danger if the child is allowed to play with toys. A landlord’s fear of getting sued does not give him the right to cancel out such rights. Courts are concerned about actual, real danger, not possible dangers that can occur. For example, there is clearly a risk if children are allowed to shoot bb guns, hit hard baseballs, or throw lawn darts in the common areas, as an injury could easily occur. Obviously, a landlord can prohibit such activities. However, there is no such risk if children toss sponge balls, blow bubbles, play hopscotch, or play badminton. There is no risk with these activities. A manager cannot prohibit kids from engaging in such activities.

(Back to questions)


Can my landlord prohibit teenagers from socializing?
No. If the rule is specifically aimed at teenagers (e.g. the rule says, "No teenagers may loiter on the premises") then the rule is illegal. The landlord is required to treat teenagers equal to adults. A landlord cannot make rules that single-out teenagers. By the same token, the landlord cannot refuse to allow teenagers to visit an apartment, simply because he is worried about them "causing trouble." Teenagers cannot be singled out. They must be treated equally as adults.
(Back to questions)

Is it permissible to have adult-only swimming hours or Jacuzzi time?

No. It is illegal to exclude children from the pool at anytime while the pool is open. A complex cannot set aside time for adults only. It is also illegal to exclude children from the Jacuzzi, unless the child is physically too young to sit in a Jacuzzi. The pool and Jacuzzi must be accessible to children during the same hours that it is accessible to adults. The law does not permit a landlord to make separate rules for children, no matter how convenient it might be to adults. A child can only be excluded if it would clearly be too dangerous for the child to use the facility. Likewise, although landlords may not want teenagers hanging out in the Jacuzzi, he cannot exclude them from such.

(Back to questions)

Can my landlord evict me if my kids make too much noise while playing inside the apartment?
No. Your landlord will probably be surprised to learn that he cannot tell your children to quit playing inside of the apartment. Federal and state fair housing laws expressly require apartment dwellers to put up with normal, reasonable noise from children. This noise would clearly include noise made by children while playing in an apartment, provided that their conduct isn’t overtly unreasonable (e.g. jumping off their beds at 1 a.m., or playing the stereo on high late at night) . The manager cannot evict you if your kids have been making normal noises while playing inside your apartment, such as laughing, giggling, or rolling on the floor. To do so is illegal. The law does NOT make another tenant’s desire for peace and quiet paramount to your children's right to play in their apartment. To the contrary, the law expressly states that a desire for peace and quiet is NOT grounds for making rules against children. Children make noise. That’s part of being a kid. The law requires landlords and tenants to put up with such noises. This would include allowing kids to play around inside their apartment at reasonable hours even if another tenant complains.

(Back to questions)

Does the peace and quiet of the community allow the landlord to prevent kids from playing outside?
No. The law requires tenants to put up with reasonable noises made by children. The law expressly states that a desire for peace and quiet is NOT grounds for making rules against children. Children make noise. That’s part of being a kid. The law requires landlords and tenants to put up with such noises. It is illegal to attempt to silence children so that others will not have to deal with their noise. Any rule that attempts to do so is illegal and unenforceable. As such, a landlord cannot prohibit children from playing hopscotch, Barbies or dolls, hand held video games, reading books, or tossing soft balls. On the other hand, the landlord can prohibit unreasonable noise or potentially harmful conduct. Along these lines, the landlord could prohibit children from playing with hard balls, from throwing darts, or from playing drums or making noise at an unreasonable hour.
 

fairisfair

Senior Member
Can my landlord require me to supervise my children when they are outside?

No. The law doesn't allow a landlord to require children to be supervised when outside unless it there is a compelling reason to justify such. A "compelling reason" is not something trivial such as the landlord’s desire for peace and quiet. Rather, a compelling reason is something that likely posed imminent danger to the child if the child wasn’t supervised, such as requiring supervision of young kids in a pool. In this situation, there is a very present danger. Otherwise, the landlord cannot require supervision of kids because he doesn’t want kids running around unattended. A parent is free to allow their children to play outside unsupervised even if the landlord doesn’t think this is good parenting. With this in mind, it is illegal for a landlord to require children to be supervised while playing in the common areas because a young child "might" wonder off or fall and hurt themselves. Unless the danger is clearly real and obvious, then a landlord cannot require supervision of a child. A landlord's fear of "liability" or concern that a child might get hurt if unsupervised is not legal grounds to permit him to require tenants to supervise their children. The landlord must leave such decisions to the parent. As one court has noted, "Safety judgments are for informed parents to make, not landlords."

(Back to questions)

Does a landlord’s concern over liability or fear of getting sued, allow a landlord to require children to be supervised?
No. Neither is a legitimate reason to require supervision. Every business in the country is fearful of these two things, but that does not mean that it can run roughshod over a person’s legal rights. By the same token, federal and state fair housing laws expressly protect the rights of families and children to be free from discrimination against children. By law, children are allowed to play outside just so long as there isn’t a compelling reason that would require supervision. A landlord’s personal fear of liability does not qualify as a compelling reason that would allow him to usurp a family’s federal and state fair housing rights. A compelling reason usually deals with a true, dangerous situation if the child is left alone, such as small children swimming in a pool unattended. If the landlord truly has a legitimate safety concern that he is trying to address, then he must take careful precautions to narrowly tailor a rule that will deal very specifically with a limited problem. For example, if the landlord is worried about young children drowning in the pool, then it is perfectly okay to have a rule that says, "Children under 14 must be supervised while swimming." However, the landlord goes too far if, in an effort to solve this problem, he creates a rule that says, "No children are allowed to play outside at anytime." Yes, this would also solve the problem, but the rule is too broad.

(back to questions)

Can a landlord refuse to allow children to play with toys or play outside because he is worried about liability or is fearful of getting sued?
No. By law, children are allowed to play outside unless there is a compelling reason to prohibit it, such as there being a real and present danger if the child is allowed to play with toys. A landlord’s fear of getting sued does not give him the right to cancel out such rights. Courts are concerned about actual, real danger, not possible dangers that can occur. For example, there is clearly a risk if children are allowed to shoot bb guns, hit hard baseballs, or throw lawn darts in the common areas, as an injury could easily occur. Obviously, a landlord can prohibit such activities. However, there is no such risk if children toss sponge balls, blow bubbles, play hopscotch, or play badminton. There is no risk with these activities. A manager cannot prohibit kids from engaging in such activities.

(Back to questions)


Can my landlord prohibit teenagers from socializing?
No. If the rule is specifically aimed at teenagers (e.g. the rule says, "No teenagers may loiter on the premises") then the rule is illegal. The landlord is required to treat teenagers equal to adults. A landlord cannot make rules that single-out teenagers. By the same token, the landlord cannot refuse to allow teenagers to visit an apartment, simply because he is worried about them "causing trouble." Teenagers cannot be singled out. They must be treated equally as adults.
(Back to questions)

Is it permissible to have adult-only swimming hours or Jacuzzi time?

No. It is illegal to exclude children from the pool at anytime while the pool is open. A complex cannot set aside time for adults only. It is also illegal to exclude children from the Jacuzzi, unless the child is physically too young to sit in a Jacuzzi. The pool and Jacuzzi must be accessible to children during the same hours that it is accessible to adults. The law does not permit a landlord to make separate rules for children, no matter how convenient it might be to adults. A child can only be excluded if it would clearly be too dangerous for the child to use the facility. Likewise, although landlords may not want teenagers hanging out in the Jacuzzi, he cannot exclude them from such.

(Back to questions)

Can my landlord evict me if my kids make too much noise while playing inside the apartment?
No. Your landlord will probably be surprised to learn that he cannot tell your children to quit playing inside of the apartment. Federal and state fair housing laws expressly require apartment dwellers to put up with normal, reasonable noise from children. This noise would clearly include noise made by children while playing in an apartment, provided that their conduct isn’t overtly unreasonable (e.g. jumping off their beds at 1 a.m., or playing the stereo on high late at night) . The manager cannot evict you if your kids have been making normal noises while playing inside your apartment, such as laughing, giggling, or rolling on the floor. To do so is illegal. The law does NOT make another tenant’s desire for peace and quiet paramount to your children's right to play in their apartment. To the contrary, the law expressly states that a desire for peace and quiet is NOT grounds for making rules against children. Children make noise. That’s part of being a kid. The law requires landlords and tenants to put up with such noises. This would include allowing kids to play around inside their apartment at reasonable hours even if another tenant complains.

(Back to questions)

Does the peace and quiet of the community allow the landlord to prevent kids from playing outside?
No. The law requires tenants to put up with reasonable noises made by children. The law expressly states that a desire for peace and quiet is NOT grounds for making rules against children. Children make noise. That’s part of being a kid. The law requires landlords and tenants to put up with such noises. It is illegal to attempt to silence children so that others will not have to deal with their noise. Any rule that attempts to do so is illegal and unenforceable. As such, a landlord cannot prohibit children from playing hopscotch, Barbies or dolls, hand held video games, reading books, or tossing soft balls. On the other hand, the landlord can prohibit unreasonable noise or potentially harmful conduct. Along these lines, the landlord could prohibit children from playing with hard balls, from throwing darts, or from playing drums or making noise at an unreasonable hour.

I am sure your post is exceedingly helpful to this woman whose lease probably ended about THREE YEARS AGO.

This post is from 2004. :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:
 

Hot Topic

Senior Member
The rules must apply to all the children in the complex. If yours can't play in area x, neither can the other children.
 

Alaska landlord

Senior Member
Hot Topic almost had it.

The landlord can restrict the playing on the complex, but it has to apply to everyone, adults included. Children cannot be signaled out.
 

acmb05

Senior Member
To quote FAIRISFAIR:

am sure your post is exceedingly helpful to this woman whose lease probably ended about THREE YEARS AGO.

This post is from 2004.
 

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