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Paternity question

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pk13

Guest
What is the name of your state? New York

Hi...I just received papers ordering me to family court for visitation by my soon to be ex husband. My question is regarding paternity. My son was born 8/01, but we did not get married until 3/03...we were not married at the time of the birth and his name is not on the birth certificate. Under NY law, does he have to establish paternity before trying to get visitation? Thanks in advance.
 


I AM ALWAYS LIABLE

Senior Member
My response:

New York Paternity

Paternity is the term by which a father is granted legally enforceable rights and responsibilities to his child. Paternity may be established in one of three ways:

1. If the parties are married, New York presumes the husband of any children of the marriage. This presumption can be rebutted.

2. Paternity can be established by the proper execution of an acknowledgment of paternity. See Family Court Act Section 516.

3. Paternity can be established by a court order.

A paternity proceeding is commenced in Family Court by the filing of a verified petition from the party seeking to establish paternity. If the woman is married, her husband must usually be named as a party to the proceeding.

Once the parties are in court, they have the option to consent to an order of paternity. Consenting to an order of paternity means that there is no question as to who is the father of the child, and that neither side is requesting blood or DNA tests. It is very difficult to overturn a consent order of paternity, so if there is any question of paternity, the order should not be entered on consent. Such an order may very well stand even if down the road it is found that the legal father is not the biological father.

If there is no consent order of paternity, the court will generally order blood or DNA tests. Once the results of the blood or DNA tests are know, the parties once again will generally have the option to consent to an order of paternity, or request a hearing.

If the case goes to a hearing, it is the party seeking to establish paternity to prove paternity by clear and convincing evidence. If, however, the probability of paternity in the blood or DNA tests is 95% or higher, New York law presumes the man is the father, and it is now his burden to overcome this presumption. At the end of the hearing, the court will consider all properly introduced evidence, and either issue an order of paternity or dismiss the paternity petition.

Probability of Paternity

Blood and DNA testing can exclude a man from being the father, but they cannot establish paternity by 100%. Blood and DNA testing involves a chemical analysis of matching proteins, and determining what the probability of paternity is based upon a statistical analysis of the number of matches. While 100% can never be reached, DNA tests can be accurate to a fraction of a percent.

Parties are not required to accept the results of the tests, and the party seeking to challenge blood or DNA testing can attack either the chain of custody of the samples, or the underlying mathematics of the statistical analysis. Such challenges are very difficult, and can be very expensive.

Estoppel

It is possible that a party in a paternity proceeding may be estopped (prevented) from denying paternity based upon that party's past actions or statements. For example, if the party has alleged paternity in some other court proceeding or document, that party may be prevented from denying paternity. Likewise, if a man has held himself out to be the father of a child, he may be estopped from denying paternity in court. Finally, the actions of a putative father can affect the statute of limitations for a paternity proceeding. Each case is fact sensitive, and must be analyzed on its own.

Statute of Limitations

The time to commence a paternity proceeding under Article 5 of the Family Court Act is any time during the pregnancy of the mother, or after the child is born, but not after twenty one years, unless paternity is somehow acknowledged by the father, or he paid support.

IAAL
 
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pk13

Guest
answers

No...he is not paying child support. He is actually incarcerated.

So if I understand correctly, (and thanks for the info by the way), it doesn't matter if we weren't married at the time of the birth, just that we were married. But I can dispute that.

also...I know he can be awarded visitation if paternity is established..but has anyone heard of a custodial parent being ordered to take the child to the jail for visitation?? I have done quite a bit of research, but haven't seen really anything on that. Thanks.
 
Last edited:

I AM ALWAYS LIABLE

Senior Member
He is actually incarcerated.

MY RESPONSE: Irrelevant - - at this point.


So if I understand correctly, (and thanks for the info by the way), it doesn't matter if we weren't married at the time of the birth, just that we were married. But I can dispute that.

MY RESPONSE: Then you're not understanding. The DNA test you'll be ordered to have for your child will be the determining factor. You can spend all the money you want to "dispute" paternity, but if the DNA comes back at 95% or greater, all that money you've spent to dispute it will be a waste.

IAAL
 
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pk13

Guest
No, I don't want to dispute paternity

I just want to establish it. And I agree, that he is incarcerated is irrelevant at this point.
 

snostar

Senior Member
NO, you didn't understand correctly. "The husband of any children of the marriage" means the child was born when the parents were married. From your post this is not the case. Paternity has not been established. A decent lawyer would advise him to request a test - this can be arrange through the court for an affordable cost.

We all know why the mother requests a test!
 
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pk13

Guest
Thanks

I actually did understand, but I didn't word my answer correctly at all!! He actually started the paternity proceeding and then I got to court and was told he had dropped it. They didn't give me a reason why, and I thought maybe he was given some kind of legal advice as to him not need it, thus the question. Thanks so much, and if anyone has answers to my other question, I would certainly appreciate it.
 

snostar

Senior Member
If you are not going to contest paternity it can be established by both of you signing an affidavit Acknowledgment of Paternity. This would then need to be filed with the registrar of the district in which the birth occurred and in which the birth certificate is filed. A judge could grant visitation if paternity is not disputed by either one of you prior to signing the Acknowledgment of Paternity. It takes at least 9 months for Albany to change the birth certificate to include the father's name.

I don't know anything about how visitation works with a parent in jail.
 
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ChevyGirl

Guest
Why would you yourself want to be the one who helps establish paternity? Maybe you stated it wrong or I read it wrong. And don't go sign no darn affidavit stating he is the dad. Let him spend all the money to pay for the paternity test and the court time to establish he is the father. That can take months. And, he probably can't even do that from jail. Also, if you have a paternity test stating he is the dad, even if it hasn't been to court to establish he is the dad, he still has to pay child support, even if he isn't getting visitation. And no, just because he pays child support and has a DNA test does NOT give him visitation rights. Establishing paternity in court and THEN getting an order from a judge is the only way he will get visitation.
 

snostar

Senior Member
ChevyGirl said:
Also, if you have a paternity test stating he is the dad, even if it hasn't been to court to establish he is the dad, he still has to pay child support, even if he isn't getting visitation.

No CS order = no support.

Establishing paternity in court and THEN getting an order from a judge is the only way he will get visitation.

Like I said, paternity does NOT have to be established for a judge to order visitation in NY if neither party contests paternity. I know what I am talking about – I lived it!!! My ex got 30% time with our child prior to paternity being legally established.

Why didn’t I contest it? First, it would not have been in our child’s best interest. Second, since I am EXTREMELY loyal in my relationships there was no reason to put my self in the position of looking like a skanky slut. Third, I refused to use our child in spitefulness as an “edge” in Family Court.

PK13, when you show up in court for visitation, paternity can be questioned. Just because he filed for visitation does not mean he will get it immediately (incarceration will not help him). Also, if you do challenge paternity be prepared to split the cost of the DNA test. Then run approximately $250 when done through the NY courts.
 

MBMom

Member
ChevyGirl said:
Why would you yourself want to be the one who helps establish paternity? ...Let him spend all the money to pay for the paternity test and the court time to establish he is the father. That can take months....And no, just because he pays child support and has a DNA test does NOT give him visitation rights.

This child is getting ready to turn three, and the mom stated he is her "soon to be" ex, which tells me he's been around for majority of the child's life, unless of course he's been incarcerated for a long time. ??

So WHY exactly would a mother want to make it more difficult for a child to see their father just because she can?

Funny, ChevyGirl, maybe you should re-read your own signature: "Before you go and post something stupid, remember this is about kids not revenge."

Um, yet your response states otherwise. This mom never gave any reasons for why this child doesn't need his dad around (accept for the fact that he's in jail, but we don't even know the details on that).
 
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pk13

Guest
thanks all

Actually he has been in jail all but four months of his son's life MB's mom. And during the four months he was out of jail, he took his son to buy drugs. I turned him in. Chevy girl is right...I am in no hurry to get my son there. I won't take him but have let my soon to be exes family know they can and they don't want to either. He wants me to, that's what this is about.
 

MBMom

Member
Well, that's a different story then. I was only referring to CG's comment about not wanting to help the situation out by prolonging the time before dad gets to see his kid.
 
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ChevyGirl

Guest
Clarification on my post

Thank you, original poster, for reading between the lines and getting the jest of what I was saying. For all of you who need thorough explanations because you are unable to draw conclusions from semi-basic information, here goes:

When I stated that she should let him pay the money and fight to get to see the child, I stand firm to that. She stated he was incarcerated. That tells me a)he is an irresponsible person (which made me think he wasn't a consistant father) and that he probably wont' take the time and affort to fight for the child. Let him PROVE how much time, effort, and money he is willing to put out. That will tell you how much of a dad he wants to be. It also tells me b) That he probably isn't a fit parent, depending on the situation. (And yes, in my opinion, jail time does make you an irresponsible unfit parent because you put yourself in a situation where someone else is having to fill your gap as a parent while you are incarcerated). I, for one, would not want my children visiting a jail to see anyone. So go ahead, gripe and moan and say everything I did say was wrong, blah blah, I don't care, I didn't post my message for anyone but the orginal poster anyway, so waste your time, please, arguing with me when you could be helping here instead of insulting.
 

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