Prospective Firing today, Need Advice

[darktsunami]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California

On Tuesday, I was asked to go home and not return until Thursday. They told me the general manager of the store [retail chain] will speak to me on that day.

I believe that I will be fired today, and here is the reason why.

On sunday, I was standing at my cash register, humming a song to myself. The song is actually a prounion song; I am trying to build a union while the store doesn't know, and I was practicing song for a seminar that I would attend this weekend for union support. The content of the lyrics were "boycott, boycott, [retail chain]'s workers rights are hot." I said it so low that I could only be audible by myself, and by the LPM (Loss prevention manager) at the time.

Without evidence from other employees and since no customers heard and cannot show evidence of me directly saying it to any customer, does this mean that I cannot be fired on willful misconduct, or do they have a basis.

I just want to be prepared for anything they might say while I speak to them, and to see if I can still get UI benefits if terminated.

 

[swalsh411]

Your termination, if it happens, would not be unlawful.

You should file for unemployment if terminated. It is unlikely you would be disqualified for misconduct for a single instance of humming a tune to yourself.

 

[Antigone*]

What is the name of your state (only U.S. law)? California

On Tuesday, I was asked to go home and not return until Thursday. They told me the general manager of the store [retail chain] will speak to me on that day.

I believe that I will be fired today, and here is the reason why.

On sunday, I was standing at my cash register, humming a song to myself. The song is actually a prounion song; I am trying to build a union while the store doesn't know, and I was practicing song for a seminar that I would attend this weekend for union support. The content of the lyrics were "boycott, boycott, [retail chain]'s workers rights are hot." I said it so low that I could only be audible by myself, and by the LPM (Loss prevention manager) at the time.

Without evidence from other employees and since no customers heard and cannot show evidence of me directly saying it to any customer, does this mean that I cannot be fired on willful misconduct, or do they have a basis.

I just want to be prepared for anything they might say while I speak to them, and to see if I can still get UI benefits if terminated.

I do not see anything wrongful about your impending termination. File for benefits when that happens.

 

[darktsunami]

So my concerns are: I have never been terminated

What should I tell them in the office if they try to misconvey the evidence and put me at fault. I hear that when you are terminated, you usually sign a form confirming a termination (validity?). I have already decided to not sign anything that they present, but will that encumber my UI benefits?

Also, In the UI benefit form, do I put laid off, or do I mark terminated and write my story in explanation. In the case of marking termination, will the workplace have to verify my story? what if they contest my benefits?

Thank you all in advance.

 

[Beth3]

You don't have to sign anything you don't want to. No, it will not encumber UI benefits.

Also, In the UI benefit form, do I put laid off, or do I mark terminated and write my story in explanation. In the case of marking termination, will the workplace have to verify my story? what if they contest my benefits?

You check the box marked "fired" (or however it's labeled.) You weren't laid off [for lack of work] so that would not be correct. Yes, your employer will be notified that you have applied for unemployment and they will have an option to contest your eligibility. If they do, then the State will make a decision. If either party disagrees with the State's decision, then either party may contest that and file for a hearing.

Signing your union song at work and within the hearing of the LP manager was dumb but I don't think it amounts to "willful misconduct" and thus you will very likely be eligible for unemployment benefits.

 

[commentator]

Whatever you do, do not accept any offer by the employer to "save your references" by allowing you the choice of quitting/resigning from the job instead of having them fire you. That is what would cause a problem with unemployment insurance. You have to be out of work through no fault of your own. If you quit, that's not the case.

If they terminate you, they have the burden of proof in unemployment law, to show that they had a valid misconduct reason to terminate you. If it was not "gross misconduct" which is something so bad that you should have known it was wrong and that doing it even once was enough reason to fire you, (Singing loud obscene choruses at your register about how you'd like to burn this *&^$ing store to the ground is an example) but anyhow, if it is not gross misconduct, then they would have to show that you had progressive discipline, in other words, you were given an opportunity to change the behavior and you chose not to.

If you have a trail of progressive discipline for being insubordinate, talking about and pushing your union song and dance routine at inappropriate times on the job, this sort of thing could show they had given you warnings and you had chosen not to change your behavior.

But in any case, polite and professional is the way to go in your formal firing meeting. Do not burn any bridges by threats or telling them what you think of them. Be sure you obtain and keep a copy of any termination letter you receive. It may be okay to sign it, if you are not admitting to any wrongdoing, simply accepting the terms of the separation. Read it carefully while sitting there.

Do not ask your employer about unemployment matters. They do not get to decide whether you draw benefits or not. You will file for benefits the first week that you have not worked and been paid. So if you are fired on Friday, wait until Sunday or Monday to file, even on line. DO NOT put on the form that you were laid off, as this would be fraud.

They will take your statement of the reason you were terminated, then they will contact the employer for the reason they say you were terminated, and then an initial decision will be made on whether or not you will be granted benefits. This decision can be appealed by either party. In any case, it will take about a month for you to begin receiving benefits if approved.

 

[darktsunami]

So I was officially terminated 63 minutes ago.

I signed the statement for separation. It was very simple, and only took 2 sentences. basically, it said that I had failed to comply with company policy.

Is this indicative of qualification for benefits in most situations?

 

[Zigner]

So I was officially terminated 63 minutes ago.

I signed the statement for separation. It was very simple, and only took 2 sentences. basically, it said that I had failed to comply with company policy.

Is this indicative of qualification for benefits in most situations?

Why did you sign THAT? If you didn't KNOW of a policy, why would you admit to violating it? Your signature would seem to indicate that you admit to intentionally violating policy...

 

[swalsh411]

There could be some general policy against causing a distration or acting unprofessionally or something equally vague. I don't think it matters if there is a policy against it or not, as a one-time instance of humming a tune (something many peopel do without even realizing it) is not misconduct.

It's also possible that what the OP signed does not qualify as agreement but rather acknoledgement that he has been terminated for this reason.

Of course if the OP agreed he violated some other major policy, like fighting, stealing, etc. then he may have seriously damaged his chances.

 

[cbg]

What company policy do they claim you failed to comply with?

 

[darktsunami]

Thats the ironic part, they failed to enumerate what policies I had failed to comply with.

I do believe it was an acknowledgement for my termination, and not necessarily agreeing to the reason for the termination.

I believe the failure to enumerate will give me high chances to acquire UI benefits.

I even asked if I could used my manager as a reference and he said yes. Nice guy, but his hands were tied from his bosses.

 

[Beth3]

You are correct. Signing the form does not mean you agree with the contents; it simply means that you acknowledge the contents.

Apply for unemployment benefits.