Unlawful Stop? Please Help...

[You Are Guilty]

I must admit, you are truly a patriot fighting for the rights of the common man when you draw a firm line at random break-ins by the police in private residences to check to see if the resident is imbibing in a legal recreation. Is that your only limit on the matter?

Yeah, pretty much. I'm all about raping children and shooting old ladies in the face just to listen to them die

Exactly my point. Because of what seems to be an increasing flaw in our representative democracy, a small group who is absolutely motivated on a single issue is able to dictate to everyone what the law should be. In a reasoned world, we would see that many people with a .08 BAC drive just fine and to make driving with that level a per se *crime* is foolish and takes away from the problem. The problem being that the vast majority of problems related to drunk driving is from an small minority of those arrested who are extremely impaired from drinking/drugs. Target the problem and stop making criminals out of people who are responsible and who may be better drivers than, older people, younger people, mother's with "baby on board", or cops who are running a check on a computer, talking on the radio or eating a donut.

As I said, Driving While Impaired (due to whatever source) laws should be enforced equally across the board, not just for DUI/DWI.

However, the problem is that there is no reliable, objective test to indicate the level of an individual's actual impairment. The next best thing we have is a presumption that over a certain BAC, impairment is more likely. Over the entire population, this has been scientifically proven. However, it is also true that on an individual level, some people do not suffer the same level of impairment as do others at the same BAC. So until we devise a better test for impairment, they will "suffer" the consequences of their less efficiently-livered brethren.

Of course, if you start enforcing poor driving in general, just about everyone in Florida is going to be screwed, and you'll have the AARP Goon Squad on your tail. (There are many reasons why people can't drive for crap that are unrelated to distractions).

 

[CdwJava]

In a reasoned world, we would see that many people with a .08 BAC drive just fine and to make driving with that level a per se *crime* is foolish and takes away from the problem.

To the contrary, they drive "just fine" because none of the usual interferences in the course of daily driving have managed to pop in to their way. It is a fact that at .08 a person's reaction and motor skills are significantly impaired. The fact that a child hasn't run out in front of them is simply fortunate, not evidence of their ability to drive "just fine."

Target the problem and stop making criminals out of people who are responsible and who may be better drivers than, older people, younger people, mother's with "baby on board", or cops who are running a check on a computer, talking on the radio or eating a donut.

There is no such thing as a "responsible" impaired driver. A LUCKY impaired driver, maybe. But he/she is certainly not "responsible."

"If the police were randomly breaking into people's houses and breathalyzing them, I'm right there fighting it. On the other hand, cutting a drunk a (huge!) break only to have him throw it in your face... not so much."

Oooh....bad example. In California, they are allowed to do nearly that.

News to me.

The courts have found that with probable cause, the police can break into a house to seize a person in order to compel a test for BAC based on the "exigent circumstance" of the alcohol being metabolized.

Can you please cite a case? Unless under "hot pursuit", I would have to disagree. If a neighbor says that Johnny Show Barfly staggered from his car into his house and called the police, it is quite doubtful that a court would permit us to boot in his door just to get a BAC. I'd be really interested in seeing the case law for that one. And, if it exists, I will bet it is a very specific set of circumstances and not applicable to the overwhelming majority of such cases.

- Carl