Interested in what everyone here thinks.

[LdiJ]

What is the name of your state? irrelevant for this discussion.

Four (4) year old girl. Primarily lives with mom but has age appropriate parenting time with dad. Dad wasn't involved much with the child until recently (his choice) so its somewhat limited but not supervised.

A few weeks before Christmas mom asked dad what he was going to get the child for Christmas so that they wouldn't duplicate presents. This was to be the child's first time to spend the night at dad's on Christmas Eve and have "santa" at dad's house. The child very much believes in santa.

Dad informed mom that the only thing the child was going to get at his house was coal in her stocking, because she was a bad child and needed to be taught a lesson. Mom didn't believe him at first, she thought that he was just "pushing her buttons"....however he was so adamant every time that she spoke to him that she eventually believed him. Mom was appalled, she told that she couldn't believe he would be so cruel and that if that was really his intention the child wasn't going. Mom was also floored that he considered the child a "bad child" and is now also concerned about what the heck goes on at dad's house.

Remember everyone, this is a 4 year old.

Anyway...mom told dad that he wasn't getting the Christmas visitation. She deliberately wasn't home on Christmas Eve at pickup time. He did arrive and left a note. He showed up the next morning at 10:00 AM with a police officer in tow. The police officer demanded that the dad be allowed to give the child her present from santa.

A stocking was handed over....the 4 year old opened it and it was coal...the 4 year old burst into tears (dad had been telling her for months that bad kids got coal from santa). The police officer was stunned and angry. The police officer told the dad to leave NOW, and remained behind comforting the child and explaining to the child that santa would never do that to her...that it was all a big mistake....that she was a good little girl..etc.

The police officer then wrote up a report that he was called by dad to help with a "visitation dispute", but that in his opinion that visitation with dad was NOT in the child's best interests. He informed mom that he would be delivering a copy to dad and apologized over and over for contributing to her child being emotionally abused in that manner. The poor officer was beside himself.

My "legal question" is.....my belief is that dad is "toast" at this point...I believe that a judge is going to "hate his guts" when/if this comes out in court..I want to know if anyone else disagrees, and if so, why?..and please remember that the child is only 4.

 

[BethM]

I've been dealing with an emotionally abusive father for six years. He has done things but nothing so blatant as hand the child a bag full of coal. The judge in our case HATES my ex husband because of those behaviors. I can't imagine any judge hearing this story and not being disgusted with this man. Thank goodness that officer was there to witness that. Ad the recent event to the fact that the father was absent from the child's life for so long I would have to agree...this guy is "toast."

Hopefully this child has been exposed to this fool for the last time.

 

[howamidoing]

What is the name of your state? irrelevant for this discussion.

Four (4) year old girl. Primarily lives with mom but has age appropriate parenting time with dad. Dad wasn't involved much with the child until recently (his choice) so its somewhat limited but not supervised.

A few weeks before Christmas mom asked dad what he was going to get the child for Christmas so that they wouldn't duplicate presents. This was to be the child's first time to spend the night at dad's on Christmas Eve and have "santa" at dad's house. The child very much believes in santa.

Dad informed mom that the only thing the child was going to get at his house was coal in her stocking, because she was a bad child and needed to be taught a lesson. Mom didn't believe him at first, she thought that he was just "pushing her buttons"....however he was so adamant every time that she spoke to him that she eventually believed him. Mom was appalled, she told that she couldn't believe he would be so cruel and that if that was really his intention the child wasn't going. Mom was also floored that he considered the child a "bad child" and is now also concerned about what the heck goes on at dad's house.

Remember everyone, this is a 4 year old.

Anyway...mom told dad that he wasn't getting the Christmas visitation. She deliberately wasn't home on Christmas Eve at pickup time. He did arrive and left a note. He showed up the next morning at 10:00 AM with a police officer in tow. The police officer demanded that the dad be allowed to give the child her present from santa.

A stocking was handed over....the 4 year old opened it and it was coal...the 4 year old burst into tears (dad had been telling her for months that bad kids got coal from santa). The police officer was stunned and angry. The police officer told the dad to leave NOW, and remained behind comforting the child and explaining to the child that santa would never do that to her...that it was all a big mistake....that she was a good little girl..etc.

The police officer then wrote up a report that he was called by dad to help with a "visitation dispute", but that in his opinion that visitation with dad was NOT in the child's best interests. He informed mom that he would be delivering a copy to dad and apologized over and over for contributing to her child being emotionally abused in that manner. The poor officer was beside himself.

My "legal question" is.....my belief is that dad is "toast" at this point...I believe that a judge is going to "hate his guts" when/if this comes out in court..I want to know if anyone else disagrees, and if so, why?..and please remember that the child is only 4.

I would be totally irate. If I were the judge I would throw the book at him, but I am not the judge, I couldnt be that rational when it came to a 4 yr old getting hurt. That is total mental abuse..
I'm thinking this really has to be some sort of trick question that I am not getting...hmmmm

 

[lonelyandsad]

dad are you nuts?

that guy ought to be horse whipped.shame on him! he doesnt deserve to see that child.

 

[ejmmolina]

One could only hope his holiday visits would be taken away at the least. Hopefully he gets punished much more severly for this. ANy kind of abuse towards a child should result in a long long prison term. People should not be allowed to hurt kids in any way

 

[rmet4nzkx]

I think the guy's shorts are too tight, if not he needs a snuggy
I would suggest that the Police officer forward his report to CPS and the mother ask for a GAL to be assigned at the father's expense along with a psych evaluation. That should get to the bottom of the issue.
I have seen things like this in families with mental disorders.

 

[SMURFEELAW]

I am really concerned as to what constitutes a "bad child" at four years old? I mean geez, don't get me wrong around x-mas we get to use the extra "threat" of Santa is watching to help curb behavior but come on now. He should be hit in the head with a one ton lump of coal for pulling that stunt. What an a**hole!!!! I wonder if there is someway to get to the judge and let him know that this kind of behavior causes public outrage!

 

[Rushia]

I have a 3 and 5 year old, my son is the five year old and he has some behavioral problems and dad and I (and both steps) all used this threat on him, but none of us would have actually done it. OMG!! I agree with the other posters and hope that the judge does hit him with a bag of coal. That poor child (and officer for that matter). That's horrible!

 

[Happy Trails]

I'm trying to keep my emotional side separate from what a Judge may think. I think a Judge is going to send him in for an evaluation. It's bizarre. I can just see him in front of the Judge saying, but your honor she is a very naughty girl.

The guy at least in my opinion isn't in his right mind. Emotionally unstable, wanting to inflict pain in the ex as well as an innocent child. SCARY

The guy is a loony, crazed, uncompassionate, poor excuse for a parent.
O.K. so it was hard for me to keep my emotions out of it.

 

[casa]

What is the name of your state? irrelevant for this discussion.

Four (4) year old girl. Primarily lives with mom but has age appropriate parenting time with dad. Dad wasn't involved much with the child until recently (his choice) so its somewhat limited but not supervised.

A few weeks before Christmas mom asked dad what he was going to get the child for Christmas so that they wouldn't duplicate presents. This was to be the child's first time to spend the night at dad's on Christmas Eve and have "santa" at dad's house. The child very much believes in santa.

Dad informed mom that the only thing the child was going to get at his house was coal in her stocking, because she was a bad child and needed to be taught a lesson. Mom didn't believe him at first, she thought that he was just "pushing her buttons"....however he was so adamant every time that she spoke to him that she eventually believed him. Mom was appalled, she told that she couldn't believe he would be so cruel and that if that was really his intention the child wasn't going. Mom was also floored that he considered the child a "bad child" and is now also concerned about what the heck goes on at dad's house.

Remember everyone, this is a 4 year old.

Anyway...mom told dad that he wasn't getting the Christmas visitation. She deliberately wasn't home on Christmas Eve at pickup time. He did arrive and left a note. He showed up the next morning at 10:00 AM with a police officer in tow. The police officer demanded that the dad be allowed to give the child her present from santa.

A stocking was handed over....the 4 year old opened it and it was coal...the 4 year old burst into tears (dad had been telling her for months that bad kids got coal from santa). The police officer was stunned and angry. The police officer told the dad to leave NOW, and remained behind comforting the child and explaining to the child that santa would never do that to her...that it was all a big mistake....that she was a good little girl..etc.

The police officer then wrote up a report that he was called by dad to help with a "visitation dispute", but that in his opinion that visitation with dad was NOT in the child's best interests. He informed mom that he would be delivering a copy to dad and apologized over and over for contributing to her child being emotionally abused in that manner. The poor officer was beside himself.

My "legal question" is.....my belief is that dad is "toast" at this point...I believe that a judge is going to "hate his guts" when/if this comes out in court..I want to know if anyone else disagrees, and if so, why?..and please remember that the child is only 4.

In most states, the police officer has already forwarded this even to Children's Services.

The report the officer wrote is a godsend in terms of protecting the mother from being filed against for contempt of visitation.

I think (& Hope) a GAL or CASA or Minor's Attorney will be appointed for the child as soon as possible.

Has mother filed an order to halt visitation pending an evaluation? If not, it would be in her child's best interest to do so. Like, yesterday!! if not sooner.

The father has mental issues and the child risks being emotionally scarred by this type of behavior. Not only that, but I would hazard to guess this is not the first time father has behaved so outrageously inappropriate. I bet the mother is now reviewing past 'odd' circumstances surrounding pick up and drop off of the child and seeing various behaviors in a dramatically new light.

On a side note~ If you speak with the mother, Mother can explain the bizarre gifts without upsetting child's belief in Santa. ie; Visitation changed and Santa brought the gift(s) to Mom's house (Tell me Mom did put out a Santa gift??!!) And that Santa does not give children's gifts to adults like that, but rather leaves them at the place the children awake on Christmas day. And, if she really wants to work on healing the shock and horror, she can say she thinks maybe the father was playing a joke- and unfortunately it wasn't very funny, but was a mistake. I'd even check into the various websites and orgs. that provide letters from Santa (Or a convincing word doc. of Mom's choice ) from Santa, which reinforces what a good little girl she really is

This story tugged at my heart-strings.....and so few do anymore, let me tell you.

 

[TX Shakespeare]

You would in contempt in Texas. Period. Your rights are very clearly
defined in custody agreement.............

 

[KKHeuser]

What is the name of your state? irrelevant for this discussion.

Four (4) year old girl. Primarily lives with mom but has age appropriate parenting time with dad. Dad wasn't involved much with the child until recently (his choice) so its somewhat limited but not supervised.

A few weeks before Christmas mom asked dad what he was going to get the child for Christmas so that they wouldn't duplicate presents. This was to be the child's first time to spend the night at dad's on Christmas Eve and have "santa" at dad's house. The child very much believes in santa.

Dad informed mom that the only thing the child was going to get at his house was coal in her stocking, because she was a bad child and needed to be taught a lesson. Mom didn't believe him at first, she thought that he was just "pushing her buttons"....however he was so adamant every time that she spoke to him that she eventually believed him. Mom was appalled, she told that she couldn't believe he would be so cruel and that if that was really his intention the child wasn't going. Mom was also floored that he considered the child a "bad child" and is now also concerned about what the heck goes on at dad's house.

Remember everyone, this is a 4 year old.

Anyway...mom told dad that he wasn't getting the Christmas visitation. She deliberately wasn't home on Christmas Eve at pickup time. He did arrive and left a note. He showed up the next morning at 10:00 AM with a police officer in tow. The police officer demanded that the dad be allowed to give the child her present from santa.

A stocking was handed over....the 4 year old opened it and it was coal...the 4 year old burst into tears (dad had been telling her for months that bad kids got coal from santa). The police officer was stunned and angry. The police officer told the dad to leave NOW, and remained behind comforting the child and explaining to the child that santa would never do that to her...that it was all a big mistake....that she was a good little girl..etc.

The police officer then wrote up a report that he was called by dad to help with a "visitation dispute", but that in his opinion that visitation with dad was NOT in the child's best interests. He informed mom that he would be delivering a copy to dad and apologized over and over for contributing to her child being emotionally abused in that manner. The poor officer was beside himself.

My "legal question" is.....my belief is that dad is "toast" at this point...I believe that a judge is going to "hate his guts" when/if this comes out in court..I want to know if anyone else disagrees, and if so, why?..and please remember that the child is only 4.

In my opinion this is a blatant example of emotional abuse and thankfully the police officer bore witness and recorded it. Evidence like this could be extremely valuable in proving the father unfit and putting a halt to the child being further subjected to it. Any judge who would allow this kind of thing to continue is out of his/her mind!!!

 

[LdiJ]

Thanks for the replies. This isn't my own situation but a situation with a parent I have been working with on another board. I was just so appalled by this that I wanted to see if the reactions to it here were the same as the reactions on the other board. They are.

What blew my mind was that the dad could be so irrational about giving the child coal that he would actually get a police officer involved to make SURE that he got to give the child the coal. That just completely blew me away.

 

[Whyte Noise]

Maybe he should put that lump of coal up his ass and see if he can sh*t a diamond.

Then again, he doesn't seem wound tight enough... so he may not have enough compression...

 

[JulieHun]

This sickens me!!

Im sitting here with tears streaming down my face..This is horrible. I pray for this child and her mother as they go through this.
I hope a judge will look at how serious this is, and realize THAT if a father can do this to his little girl on Christmas Morning, a day that is supposed to be filled with Love, Peace & Joy, what may he be doing the rest of the year?!? That would be my big question if I were the lawyer that may represent the Mother. Keep us updated on this, this causes me great concern.