this daddy needs your advice

[FJ1200guy]

I tell you what is hard for some folks to understand... the kids are being damaged by their mom. EC and Tammy keep refering to "fighting parents" and the "Parents bahaviour"... pluralizing parent is extremely insulting to a Dad. It's only one parent that is at fault in particular situation, unless the guy is openly antagonizing the woman, which I've seen no indication of from what's been posted.

My whole issue with dad just bailing on his kids is how much it will hurt the kids. THIS is what EC doesn't get, most likely because she has either never played sports, or always had her parents there... or whatever. I have been there. I have dealt with many kids who have been there. I have seen older kids talk about it and how it felt... I've FELT it and SEEN it.

Once the ex sees you will NOT back down, only THEN will she learn to deal with you being there. You've GOT to show her you will not go away! Do you understand what it will be like if you show her she can manipulate you by using the kids??? You will be dealing with her EVERY time she feels bitchy, or she is not getting what she wants from you or she's just in a bad mood! This isn't about the moment. It's NOT about the games. It's about the long term mental health of these kids.

This chick is like a child. You are an adult. Do what adults do. Support your kids, and you will be rewarded.

Good luck with the psycho.

Done, Lyle

 

[karma1]

That was my point way back when this first started...

FJ!
So, ellen deleted and yet, still comes back to this thread. Which makes the whole arguement she created, or position she stood on not make sense at all~
I dont get it, either since dad said he would continue to go to games etc...and the children want him there.
Moot point now~

 

[tammy8]

In 10 or 15 yrs, what is the child going to remember?

I never once said the Dad was part of the fight but we all as step or bio parents know it does NOT take 2 to fight over kids. Yes walk away but where does that leave the kid and leave the kid's feelings.

Again bomb away but from my experience once the power struggle of our bm ended mainly because my DH never gave her the fuel to continue on and on and humilate and pull the kids off the field, bm gave up.

To all the NCPs your day will come and most kids will know who was the fighter of the 2.

Good luck to orginal poster as I know what is felt like watching my DH have his heart torn out each and everyday by a selfish bm. Her day is coming (already has with one of the 3 kids).

 

[stealth2]

You're right, Tammy. The kids see things pretty clearly.

 

[wenwas]

ok in tammy in ellens point of view what is the dad suppose to do when the child he has custody of and one he doesnt have custody have an event together just drop the child off and tell him he'll be back later? what will that be telling his children?

 

[ellencee]

What has my point of view got to do with anything anymore? Can't you people think for yourselves? Apparently, some of you can not; so if you're going to continue to use my answers to formulate your thoughts and your posts, use the following paragraph as a reference and have a good time at my expense. I think you must need something to make you feel better about yourselves and your lives and it's all I have to offer you. I just don't see why you have to take so seriously a hypothetical situation of which we have no real knowledge or why you feel you have to try and gain something on me. It's not a contest, you know. It's a free legal advice forum and the answers are supposed to be based on personal and, or professional experience with the legal system. Not everyone is going to have the same opinion and it is not expected or even desired. Remember court? Plaintiff and Defendant? not Plaintiff and Plaintiff or Defendant and Defendant? Two, opposing viewpoints that make up the litigation scenario?

Just to summarize my deleted posts--I say Dad can only control his behavior and if his behavior (coaching, going to every event and placing himself in full view) is going to cause the children (of whom he DOES NOT have custody) to suffer because of the mother's reaction to him, then his only recourse is to remove himself from the mom's presence UNTIL she calms down and that the mother and the father need some serious psychological help and the children need a guardian ad litem, whether attorney or volunteer, to represent their interest and I'm sure the children need counseling, too. Oh, I almost forgot--Mom didn't post here so I haven't given her any advice. I did say I think she is acting like a psycho w(b)itch and needs some therapy. The father posted asking what HE could do to save his children; I answered solely on what HE could do. When mom posts, I'll tell her what I think she can do. I have never defended the mom's behavior, but I can understand why she is so upset with her cheating husband that she has lost her cool and lost control of her behavior and lost control of treating her children properly. OK?

Have fun; truly; have fun...I have no ill feelings towards you, any of you.

EC

 

[FJ1200guy]

"I have never defended the mom's behavior, but I can understand why she is so upset with her cheating husband that she has lost her cool and lost control of her behavior and lost control of treating her children properly. "


Lie.

"Have fun; truly; have fun...I have no ill feelings towards you, any of you"



Lie.


"Not everyone is going to have the same opinion and it is not expected or even desired."


Funny, you sure don't like anyone else saying an opinion different from yours.




And I am only here now for the entertainment. LOVE watching you dance. heh heh

 

[ellencee]

FJ1200guy
Who's dancing?
EC

 

[TiTi]

Age determination

Every state is different regarding the age a child or minor can decide which parent they chose to live with.

Check with your States Department of Human Services as well as your lawyer or a lawyer if you do not have one.
Ask how the age is determined?
Most important contact a psychologist and discuss with them the best way to approach this type of situation for the kids sake. We as parents sometimes lose sight as to how the child might feel in the end of a decission because we focus so much on our own pain. We are adults and can heal and handle disapointment. But its rather hard at young ages. Aside from death chosing between two parents you love can be just as hard to deal with. Becareful and cautious.

Are the children asking to live with you?
Are they implying they are having problems with the mother?

Just a thought:
From your post it seems she is doing everything she can do harm the relationship you carry with your children. I am so sorry to hear that.
I was married 11 years to an alcoholic. He eventually stopped and sobered up two years ago. On top of that he was a cheat and a liar and so selfish. I still carry amazement that I stayed for so long. But regardless of that I NEVER bad mouth him in front of my kids or to my kids.

My issues with him are just that. WITH HIM. I may not like him very much but for goodness sake... we all have people we do not like that we grin and bear it for whatever reason.
Unless you were a HOT HEAD that liked to beat on her or your kids, had an addiction that would cause her to have concern for their safety or just a downright DOG she really needs to grow up and be an adult.

I understand you have had a counselor acknowledge the situation with your children.
Have you looked into other chancery courts?
Can you request a different judge based on some (from your post) obvious prejudices. (spelled that wrong)

Children are so impressionable at young ages and she surely knows this. Just be strong daddy... keep going to the functions...but stay back though so not to cause a scene and give her fuel. If your kids do not see you at the time you can always tell them something about that function that you would have HAD to know about if you were there. They will appreciate your loyalty. Maybe even if it is feasable explain to your kids that daddy might not be right up front but that he is there because he knows it upsets mommy right now and he wants "everyone" to have a good time. That way you are saying.. Im hear and I want "everyone" to have a good time and I do not want any fights... your children will surely enjoy themselves. I cannot imagine what they must feel when she does this. Enforce your love and loyalty to your kids and just keep that going. Talk with them about their feelings. She will have to answer for her actions at some point. Just be patient. And be there for your kids. They will NEVER forget your determination to be there.

Good luck! I wish you the very best...

 

[stealth2]

Re: Age determination

Every state is different regarding the age a child or minor can decide which parent they chose to live with.

You're mistaken on this point, TiTi. Only one state (GA) permits minors to decide where they will live - and the age is 14. In all other states, a judge is permitted to take the child's wishes into account (depending on the child's age and level of maturity - 12 seems to be a general threshhold) and to decide what weight to give the child's wishes. But the child does not decide where to live until they turn 18.

 

[JaneyS4]

Hi folks! Just came by to see what's been going on, and ran across this thread. Wow, its a hot one, I can see.

I agree that what this mom doing is WRONG. She's causing the kids to suffer, and maybe implanting subconcious messages in their brains that dad is keeping them from having fun. She ought to be kicked in the caboose, but what can you do?

I can also see where Ellencee is comming from, she's thinking about how to fix it where the kids get to do their activities, instead of mom pulling them out to spite dad. Thinking of it in that perspective, i.e. how to let the children continue their activities, it seems the best solution at the moment. All be it, not a great solution for anyone involved.

Basically, this comes down to another case of an adult putting their feelings before their kids. Mom's mad, seeking to punish dad, using the kids to do it. Dad's mad, because mom's punishing him, trying to not let her dictate his participating in his kids activities (which I think he SHOULD be allowed to to) and by refusing to let mom dictate, the kids get punished. Either way, with the situation as it is now, the KIDS lose.

Perhaps an alternative solution could be found. Maybe dad could make friends with some other parents whose children participate in the same activities his do. Perhaps they could Video tape these events for him. Then he could watch the tapes WITH the children, so they would know dad DOES care. Maybe he could explain to the children, in NON-Derogative terms, that mom is a little upset right now, so it would be better for him not to attend the events in person, till she calms down.

That of course is just a suggestion, I'm sure others could be found, but if the true focus is the KIDS, then the outrage at someone doing you a wrong HAS to come AFTER the concern that the children are missing out.

Just my.02 worth...

 

[ellencee]

All be it, not a great solution for anyone involved.

JaneyS4

Janey!
I don't think I've ever seen the word, albeit, divided into three words, all be it. So, I looked up the word, albeit, and guess what? Those are the root words, all be it; you can write it that way and still be correct!

Thank you for being one of the ones who understood what I was trying to say. I believe you may have stated it more clearly than I did, too.

EC

 

[JaneyS4]

LOL. Ellen!!

You know, I was never sure how to spell that word (or words) correctly, too lazy to look it up! Thanks for both , giving me the proper spelling, and protecting me from the spelling ****s!

You know, dad could look at finding an alternative way to watch the kids activities in another light, besides being deprived. He could look at it as a way to take away a sorce of control from mom. Its been my experience with folks like that, if you take away the opportunity to do something spiteful, it drives them nuts. By NOT being there for her to snatch the kids up and leave, she loses her chance to do something mean and vindictive to him. If he takes the opportunity away for long enough, she may loose interest in trying.

The key to stoping manipulative behavior is not fighting back, or getting stubborn, cause thats just manipulating too. The key is to TAKE AWAY THE OPPORTUNITY TO MANIPULATE. Especially in a situation like this, when the little ones are getting caught in the cross fire.

I think that it would be just as effective to get someone to tape these activities, watch them with the kids on his weekends, and have the satisfaction of knowing he's beat her at her own game, WITHOUT depriving his children.

Edited to add: the ****d out word was N A Z I!

 

[ellencee]

The key to stoping manipulative behavior is not fighting back, or getting stubborn, cause thats just manipulating too. The key is to TAKE AWAY THE OPPORTUNITY TO MANIPULATE. Especially in a situation like this, when the little ones are getting caught in the cross fire.

JaneyS4

You get a chorus of 'Amens"!

I should know better to say this, and really I do know better, but here goes...

I think in this situation it is Dad who is being manipultative. He caused the divorce and he caused the Mom's anger. She hasn't recovered, yet. He's not even honoring her anguish and anger in the slightest bit. He cheated on her, causing the divorce; yet, he's everywhere she and the children are participating as if the marriage and the family are still intact. I don't think I would have snatched my children off of the field, but I do think I would have taken my child off of any team that my cheating ex was coaching. (my ex did not cheat on me; that wasn't our reason for divorcing.)

In saying that, I am not excusing Mom's behavior. I am simply saying that I believe that Dad had no respect for Mom during the marriage and is callously exploiting Mom's vulnerability now. How many of us, including FJ1200guy, would want to have the person (that recently deeply hurt and humiliated) us be present everytime we went somewhere with the children? Mom is out of control and she isn't going to gain any control over her behavior when the wounds are freshly opened every time she takes the children somewhere.

Maybe she should be allowed to beat the living snot out of him, pound him with her fist until she couldn't hit him another time. She might be able to stand being around him after that; but, that is not a socially or legally acceptable option for Mom.

Currently, Dad wants to be allowed to show up like a big flag waving in Mom's face and hold her accountable for being 100% of the problem. Mom is running from him and dragging the children with her. She is probably not even aware of what she is doing to the children. If and when she is allowed to heal, she is going to realize what she has done to the children and a whole new set of emotional whammies is going to hit her.

I don't see a happy end to this dysfunctional family's conflicts unless they all get some aggressive counseling.

EC

 

[JaneyS4]

I have to admit, I was strictly looking at the situation from dad's side, and hadn't given much thought to moms, which obviously you have. Good points.

I guess the truth of the matter is, no one on this board can really know who is manipulating, and who is being manipulated, although, obviously, someone is.

While I really do believe that any anger towards one another parents have should be put aside for childrens sake, I realize that its not always easy to do that. And I believe both of these people are putting their needs before their kids in this case.

In an ideal situation, the kids could participate in their activities, dad could be there to watch, and mom could too, without feeling harassed or bothered by dads presence. Of course, in an ideal world, spouses don't cheat, and no one gets divorce and kids get happy homes.

I do think that what happened between the two adults shouldn't be allowed to affect the ability of dad to participate in his childrens lives, no matter what he did to mom. But I also agree that he should respect mom's time too. I don't know how a suitable agreement could be reached for both to happen though. Perhaps an agreement between the two that he attend some things, and she attend others?