Unauthorized deposit and withdrawal by joint account holder

[Coot]

Fortunately, this issue has been resolved, somewhat.

I agree that opening his mail was illegal, but since I am just the evil step mom, it surely is my fault somehow that his mother opened his mail.

 

[rmet4nzkx]

Rmet, I never inquired about your gender because I knew you were a gossip looking for trouble or a story that wasn't there. LOL!!! This statement shows just how well you read the posts, just about as well as you tell the truth. It was Veronica who thouught I was male. That comes from doing work where I must be objective in evaluating people in forensic situations, perhaps why I come on a bit strong because it is my work to evaluate things such as truthfulness, you were not truthful. I suspect you are middle aged, over weight, and have few friends. What does your opinion of me have to do with the fact that the mother did nothing illegal and it is between the mother and son. You are the one stiring things up, if anything my age is a bonus because I have a wealth of experience and knowledge to share, perhaps something your step-son could use. By the way I have successfully raised 2 sons and a number of their friends as well, so many come to me for help in their lives, sometimes a bit much when the call comes in the middle of the night, but I am there for them.

You have accused me of lying, which I haven't, you have accused me of posting when my husband posted, which I didn't, and you have accused me of wrongdoing regarding my step son, which is bogus. You lied and falsly accused the mother, you did that to get sympathy. Whine all you want, blame it on someone else, it doesn't change the facts.
Since you are so defensive of the mother, this leads me to believe that you yourself are an immoral person. WHAT??? How does informing you of the legal reality make me an immoral person, that is not defensive of he mother, the is fact.
For the most part, if you are untrusting of others it is a reflection of yourself. I calls them as I sees them, you lied, you got caught, there is nothing to trust in anything you say.
Making accusations based upon the fact that I am the step mother, and for no other reason, makes me believe that you have real issues with a step mother in your dealings. Your accusations were false, I pointed that out, that is the only thing I have an issue with and it would be the same no matter who you were. People who lie, like you do, naturally don't like to get caught, it has nothing to do with you being a step parent. In fact in my work, I currently am working with a situation where the mother is actually abusing her son and the step mom is the one trying to get her step son help. In this case the son is a dependent adult, however the reccommendation is for a representive payee who is not a family member so as to not create more conflict.
You are too emotionally involved in this post, maybe you should see a doctor, there are meds you can take that can help you control your emotions. Emotions have nothing to do with it, you are the one who is overinvolved, you are the one who needs medications. Why do you have to go to such lengths, I gave you the answer, you didn't like it, you hated that you were caught in your lies and that your spiteful vengence were unmasked.

Initially, my step son thought he closed the account. Later he found out that draining the account didn't close it. Case closed. This was misinformation we were given, not an assumption, not a lie, misinformation from my step son.

While the mother didn't do anything legally wrong, she was morally wrong for transferring HIS money into HER account. The money was his, if she wasn't planning on taking it for her own, she would have left it in the joint account. Anyone with half a brain can see that she had no intention of giving him HIS money. Has he asked her for the money back yet?

When my step son moves into my house and is constantly upset by his mother's actions, it involves me and I will help him if at all possible. Just as I would my own children if they were in the same situation. When it is brought into my home it becomes my business, when it concerns my family and my finances, it becomes my business. You love all the attention!

Veronica, you may have voiced the same as Rmet, but I didn't ask for the soap opera that Rmet tried to create. I simply asked for advice regarding this chain of events. You simply answered without calling me a liar and I appreciate that.

Call the doctor in the am and get some meds for yourself, unfortunately they can't give you truth serum on a regular basis. Allow your step son to work things out with his mom without your interference.

 

[rmet4nzkx]

Actually, she did do one thing that was illegal. Opening his mail and taking possession of the check in the first place was illegal.

You are assuming she didn't have permission to do that, most likely if they shared the account, she had permission to open the mail and deposit the check, otherwise why share the account?

 

[rmet4nzkx]

Coot, Don't waste your breath w/these ppl. I also am a stepmom who only has my stepson's best interests at heart. I also wrote in here and asked a simple question. I also was attacked for sticking my nose where it didn't belong. These ppl just don't get it. Everywhere you look there is remarriage and stepparents involved. Fact. It scare's me to think where some children would be today if the evil stepparent didn't get involved. I think you are right when you said they think this is ***** Dr. Phil. This is nothing like it purports to be.

I can point you to threads here where the step parents are supported, but they are not playing games like OP, their concern is obvious as is their truthfulness.

 

[Coot]

All I hear is blah blah blah....

Rmet, are you actually stupid enough to think I would have posted asking for advice if he had asked for the money back and she said yes? There would be no reason to ask for advice, would there.

Of course he asked for the money back and she told him no, well, I'm sorry that is a lie, first she told him that they didn't send all of the money back, when he told her he talked to the college and they confirmed that they had sent the entire amount, then she told him no.

 

[rabbar]

Mom opening her adult's son mail without his permission is unlawful. It doesn't matter if the mail is coming from a University or even the bank they have a joint account at, if it isn't addressed to Momma she has no right to open it.

Mom endorsing her adult's son check without his permission is unlawful. Mom writing "For deposit only" on the back and depositing it to a joint account is unlawful without her adult son's permission. The bank that accepted the check is on the hook as the STOLEN check was not endorsed by the son, it doesn't matter that the check was deposited to a joint account.

Where on earth are people getting the idea that just because you have a joint account someone can open mail addressed SOLELY to yourself, help themselves to whatever is inside and forge endorsements?

 

[rmet4nzkx]

All I hear is blah blah blah....

Rmet, are you actually stupid enough to think I would have posted asking for advice if he had asked for the money back and she said yes? There would be no reason to ask for advice, would there.

Of course he asked for the money back and she told him no, well, I'm sorry that is a lie, first she told him that they didn't send all of the money back, when he told her he talked to the college and they confirmed that they had sent the entire amount, then she told him no.

This is more information you withheld, intentionally and your story continually changes so at this point you lack creditibility since your first lie. I assume nothing you say at this point is true, especially given your continued failure to answer the questions.

It is still between the son and his mother and any failure on the son's part to recover his money if it is rightfully his, rests on his shoulders, which has not changed from the first responses.

 

[rmet4nzkx]

Mom opening her adult's son mail without his permission is unlawful. It doesn't matter if the mail is coming from a University or even the bank they have a joint account at, if it isn't addressed to Momma she has no right to open it. As far as we know mom did have permission at the point that this happened and step mother refuses to answer the questions and has lied, if the mother has done this after permission was withdrawn the son can take legal action himself.

Mom endorsing her adult's son check without his permission is unlawful. Mom writing "For deposit only" on the back and depositing it to a joint account is unlawful without her adult son's permission. The bank that accepted the check is on the hook as the STOLEN check was not endorsed by the son, it doesn't matter that the check was deposited to a joint account. This statement is totally false and already answered by a bank officer, it is perfectly legal to put "for deposit only" on a check and deposit it into an account for the same name, with or without permission, but the mother had permission. The problem is when it is endorsed with another name, a name is forged or without POA if needed, lacks required signature, cash back without authorization etc. In this case mom was authorized on the account, the deposit was legal as was it's transfer. Those are the facts, this is no judgement on the morality of the action, nor proof of who was entitled to the money as there is a dispute, the son will have to follow up on this himself. Such disputes are frequently based on false asumptions and OP refused to provide the answers to the questions suggesting her assumptions and continued accusations are false.

Where on earth are people getting the idea that just because you have a joint account someone can open mail addressed SOLELY to yourself, help themselves to whatever is inside and forge endorsements?

You are making assumptions. Nothing was forged, the check was properly endorsed and deposited.

 

[Ladynred]

Maybe what Mom did at the bank was legal, BUT she still had NO business opening her son's mail. Opening other people's mail, especially since it was apparently addressed ONLY to the son, is a FEDERAL offense ! Her status on the bank account has NO bearing on and gives NO permission for her to open is mail - period. She was wrong from the get-go. The kid needs to get a lawyer. If he IS owed money thru the divorce decree, then she is in contempt of that court order and he needs to pursue it as such with the court.

 

[rmet4nzkx]

Maybe what Mom did at the bank was legal, BUT she still had NO business opening her son's mail. Opening other people's mail, especially since it was apparently addressed ONLY to the son, is a FEDERAL offense ! Her status on the bank account has NO bearing on and gives NO permission for her to open is mail - period. She was wrong from the get-go. The kid needs to get a lawyer. If he IS owed money thru the divorce decree, then she is in contempt of that court order and he needs to pursue it as such with the court.

Opening someone else's mail without permission is a federal offense, however, in all the statements from OP, never once has she claimed that mom did not have her son's permission to open his mail. OP said she believed it was not right to open the mail and she said the mom lied about the check after making a lot of false accusations, that there was a dispute as to whether or not this money was rightfully the son's as a result of the divorce decree and OP refused to clarify exactly the wording of the decree and questions if it involved post secondary educational support, suggesting the mother may have some valid claim on the money as she claims or that the money may be held in trust until the son returns to college if that is the purpose of the money, again, OP refuses to answer the questions necessary to clarify these issues. All this stirrs up a lot of emotion without any basis, let son and mother work this out on their own.

 

[rabbar]

Opening someone else's mail without permission is a federal offense, however, in all the statements from OP, never once has she claimed that mom did not have her son's permission to open his mail. OP said she believed it was not right to open the mail and she said the mom lied about the check after making a lot of false accusations, that there was a dispute as to whether or not this money was rightfully the son's as a result of the divorce decree and OP refused to clarify exactly the wording of the decree and questions if it involved post secondary educational support, suggesting the mother may have some valid claim on the money as she claims or that the money may be held in trust until the son returns to college if that is the purpose of the money, again, OP refuses to answer the questions necessary to clarify these issues. All this stirrs up a lot of emotion without any basis, let son and mother work this out on their own.

While you seem to feel it necessary to dig deeply into people's lives, seemingly a sport around here, and call them liars it is much more reasonable on a free advice site to simply address the apparent issues is a clear manner.

1) Opening mail without permission is generally unlawful.
2) Taking items from someone else's mail is generally unlawful

In addition, you need a refresher course in banking if you consider a "For deposit only" endorsement to be a complete endorsement. A check that is endorsed "For deposit only" without the permission of the payee and then deposited without the permission of the payee has a forged/missing endorsement.

That a bank will accept such a check is hardly an indication that the endorsement is complete or proper. Banks typically retain the right to guarantee endorsements that are missing but do so at their own risk.

That the check was deposited, without the permission of the payee, to a joint account that included the payee is equally irrelevant as to whether the check was properly endorsed. Unless the payee gave permission, the payee gets to decide what to do with the check. Frame it, cash it, deposit it to account #1 or deposit it to account #2.

 

[BelizeBreeze]

While you seem to feel it necessary to dig deeply into people's lives, seemingly a sport around here, and call them liars it is much more reasonable on a free advice site to simply address the apparent issues is a clear manner.

1) Opening mail without permission is generally unlawful.
2) Taking items from someone else's mail is generally unlawful

In addition, you need a refresher course in banking if you consider a "For deposit only" endorsement to be a complete endorsement. A check that is endorsed "For deposit only" without the permission of the payee and then deposited without the permission of the payee has a forged/missing endorsement.

That a bank will accept such a check is hardly an indication that the endorsement is complete or proper. Banks typically retain the right to guarantee endorsements that are missing but do so at their own risk.

That the check was deposited, without the permission of the payee, to a joint account that included the payee is equally irrelevant as to whether the check was properly endorsed. Unless the payee gave permission, the payee gets to decide what to do with the check. Frame it, cash it, deposit it to account #1 or deposit it to account #2.

and you are generally WRONG. Try again.

 

[Coot]

Opening someone else's mail without permission is a federal offense, however, in all the statements from OP, never once has she claimed that mom did not have her son's permission to open his mail.

He didn't giver her permission to open his mail or deposit the check. He was staying here and thought he had completed the necessary paperwork with the college to change his address. There was some confusion at the college and they sent the check to his previous address, made out to him and only him. She opened and deposited the check a week before he called the college to inquire as to why it was taking so long for his check to arrive. The college told him they would issue a stop payment and reissue the check to him, he called back to make sure this was taken care of and the college told him they couldn't do a stop payment because the check had already cleared the bank. He was unaware that she had received the check a week before, therefore, he couldn't have given permission to open/deposit the check, she never told him she received it. She even lied to him when he asked her about it and told him they didn't refund all of the funds. As you can see, he is 18 and so far hasn't done a very good job at taking care of his business. That is why we are trying to help him, as his parents that is our job. And don't give me that your his step mom so you don't have any business in this crap, he is my step son, when he comes to US for help, I will be involved. HE CAME TO US FOR HELP!!!!!!

In the future, Rmet, it may be wise for you to analyze the information presented and give your advice and quit trying to find fault in the people that post on here. You are offensive, arrogant, stupid and of little value in an advice forum.

 

[rmet4nzkx]

In the future, Rmet, it may be wise for you to analyze the information presented and give your advice and quit trying to find fault in the people that post on here. You are offensive, arrogant, stupid and of little value in an advice forum.

Hey, It's too little too late, anything you say at this point means nothing. YOU were the one who refused to give the facts necessary to give advice and what you gave, changed. YOU were the one that lied and falsley accused the mom, in your effort to gain sympathy.

I did anayze the information given and several others also confirmed that information and advice, not emotional responses. There is no way you can get me to believe at this point that if he had a joint account with his mother, that he never gave her permission to open his mail while he was away at college, especially a check. Did he change his mind after the fact or after you two dicide to badmouth the mom? He does not have to give her permission to deposit a check with his name only, into his account that is endorsed "for deposit only", nor is it fraud to transfer it, if she is an authorized person on the account, you obviously were not. No matter how many times you whine about this or call me names, the facts don't change. Your reactions are as predictable as the sun comng up in the east every morning. If I were wrong, I can name a whole bunch of members who would be all over this thread in a hot minute.

The advice remains the same, have the son and his mother work this out between them and YOU step back and stay out of it.

 

[Ladynred]

that he never gave her permission to open his mail while he was away at college,

Pardon my french, but BULLS*IT !! He wasn't away at college, he was already out and just because he's away it does NOT give her free reign to open his mail ! I can't think of ANY 18 yr olds, male or female, who would want Mom or Dad opening their personal mail. You seem to have a real bug up your butt regarding step-parents and I, for one, think you were asking for more than was necessary to answer the question. We don't normally ask for a person's life history when answering questions !

I'll say it again, he's 18, the age of majority, and he needs to deal with his mother and he needs a lawyer !! Most 18 yr olds haven't a clue how the real world works yet - the "closing" of the bank account is a perfect example of that. Who knows where he got the idea, but I know ADULTS far older than 18 who think the same thing ! It might have been wise for him to have his mother on his account while he was a minor, but NOW its time to remover her entirely. In fact, since she works for that bank, I'd make damn sure the account is permanently and legitimately closed and he should open an account in another bank - one she doesn't work for. With internet banking so prevalent these days, there's no reason he needs mommy on his bank account, its time he learned how to handle it all himself. Since he is still very young, I can see NOTHING wrong with his father and step-mother helping hom out. Not all step-mothers are 'evil' or have nasty motives

Everyone still wants to believe that its 'mom' who gets dumped on in a divorce -- guess what, they are just as much the dumpers as the are the dumpees and they are usually more vicious about it too.