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nikkilt28

Member
What is the name of your state?MO

My sister left her BF in August, got a protection order for herself, and one for their mutual child as well. The child at the time was 9 months old, and was appointed a GAL. At the court hearing to request the Full order of protection, the lawyers made the following arrangement:

he was to have no contact with my sister or the child EXCEPT for 4 1/2 hours every saturday, to be supervised by the Franklin county chapter of People Against Domestic Violence (PADV). He was ordered to pay $300 a month child support, starting October 1st, AND he had to pay the $5 per hour per parent for the visitations. The GAL was completely against any visitation for him. They dropped the child protection order, therefore, the GAL no longer represents the baby. (her lawyer did not explain that would happen)

Since that time, he was almost a month behind on his first payment, she got half in the middle of the month and the remainder two days before his next was due. He has yet to pay since then. Although he had 4 1/2 hours a week to visit his daughter, he took only two hours every other week. He would always say he had to work and could only schedule for 2 hours. then usually, every other week, he would call last minute and cancel. He did it so often, the PADV office adjusted the visitation to every other week.

Now the PADV office is facing budget cuts and can no longer offer the visitations. He likely only has 1 or 2 left.

number one, once PADV stops, is my sister obligated to continue the visitations with him? She does have a protection order against him, so it would have to be supervised since she can't be there.

My sister's contact person with PADV is dumb. She allowed the ex BF to enter the building at the same time as my sister was there, and continually encouraged phone conversations between my sister and the ex. both of these clearly violate the order. The manager at PADV enforced the order, but she has quit due to the budget cuts. Now the other woman is calling my sister with stories about drug dealers and wife beaters who are allowed unsupervised visits with their children. My sister is scared he will be awarded custody. He had two other children that he signed over to get out of paying child support. he only paid attention to the baby when he was drunk or when he needed to use her to get sympathy from people when they tried to collect money from him. He has never, in a year, referred to the baby by name. he calls her "the baby". his mentally challenged aunt claims that he molested her, and he believes that it's "wrong" for a father to change his daughter's diaper. which tells me he has thoughts he shouldn't be having about his own infant daughter. He has had an opportunity to see her close to 40 hours since the court hearing. he has taken maybe half of that. one time he was so drunk, someone else had to call and cancel the visit for him. He has got in trouble since that time, getting massive fines for poaching. He even called my sister and asked how much it would take for her to drop the protection order so he could get his gun back to go hunting. (already 2 weeks behind on support at that time). He has known drug dealers and users living with him. The house he lives in now was his aunts, and it is nasty due to her urinating and deficating on herself for years. He doesn't want her, he just keeps showing up cuz he thinks he's scaring my sister.

What chance does he have to get custody?
 


brisgirl825

Senior Member
Tell your sister not to worry. He would have to prove a change in circumstance or prove mom unfit.

As for the visitation issue. I am not quite for sure. He was ordered to only have supervised visits at the PAVD, correct?
 

nikkilt28

Member
visitation

yes. The GAL was against him getting her, but did consent to supervised visitation only. It was discussed at length and he has no family and no friends she could trust to supervise, so that's when it was decided the PADV office would do it. It's actually part of the Full Order of Protection.

So if PADV can no longer do it, and it's already been decided that there is no one else fit, does she have to continue those visits. Especially if a GAL was against him having any visitiation at all
 

brisgirl825

Senior Member
nikkilt28 said:
yes. The GAL was against him getting her, but did consent to supervised visitation only. It was discussed at length and he has no family and no friends she could trust to supervise, so that's when it was decided the PADV office would do it. It's actually part of the Full Order of Protection.

So if PADV can no longer do it, and it's already been decided that there is no one else fit, does she have to continue those visits. Especially if a GAL was against him having any visitiation at all

Since the order specifically states that visits must take place at PAVD, I would say that she culd deny visits until such time as there is an alternate place to conduct visitation.

However, wait for another poster's input, just as a precaution. I want to make sure that, that would be the correct advice here.
 

BelizeBreeze

Senior Member
nikkilt28 said:
So if PADV can no longer do it, and it's already been decided that there is no one else fit, does she have to continue those visits. Especially if a GAL was against him having any visitiation at all
what is the EXACT language in the visitation order?
 

nikkilt28

Member
protection order

not sure of the exact language. I do know that the order states he cannot contact my sister except for child issues. his first visit was either a sunday afternoon at his friends house for 2 hours, or if the friend could not do it, it would be the next evening at PADV office. every visit thereafter would be every saturday from 12-4:30 at the PADV office.

since the manager has quit, and my sister's contact at PADV does not enforce the protection order, can she stop the visits on her own? he likely only has 2 left anyway. but my sister is afraid that since the manager is no longer there, something bad will happen. He knows this other woman is a pushover.
 

JBMD

Member
nikkilt28 said:
not sure of the exact language. I do know that the order states he cannot contact my sister except for child issues. his first visit was either a sunday afternoon at his friends house for 2 hours, or if the friend could not do it, it would be the next evening at PADV office. every visit thereafter would be every saturday from 12-4:30 at the PADV office.

since the manager has quit, and my sister's contact at PADV does not enforce the protection order, can she stop the visits on her own? he likely only has 2 left anyway. but my sister is afraid that since the manager is no longer there, something bad will happen. He knows this other woman is a pushover.


You say he only has 2 visits left! What is supposed to happen after that? Why is it that his visitation was limited to a certain number of supervised visits? Is he supposed to get unsupervised visitation after so many supsevised visits?
 

nikkilt28

Member
2 visits

the visits were supposed to end because the PADV office was longer going to offer them due to budget cuts. At this time, they are continuing

The visitations were not ordered by the court, it was something the PADV rep suggested to my sister so that the judge would see that my sister isn't necessarily saying he can't see the baby, he would just need to be supervised. She told my sister if she allowed it, then he would just hang himself. Which he is doing quite nicely!

My sister would rather he just give up rights like he did with his other 2 kids
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
Your sister needs to get a court order specifying visitation. Period.

And if she knew how he did his other kids - what the hell was she doing having one by him? Jaysus Christ on Crutches - women can be stupid.
 

nikkilt28

Member
stupid women

yeah,

pretty stupid. but accidents do happen sometimes. he turned the other 2 kids over to ex wife who had remarried and the new husband wanted to adopt them. It happened early in his relationship with my sister when she was still "so in love" and it's "all the exes fault".

but to give the devil his due, the ahole had straightened himself out for year when she got pregnant. no drinking, no fighting. until she realized she was pregnant!

as for your suggestion to get a court order specifying visitation, she doesn't want him to have any. Paternity has not been established. she is being told by the GAL that was appointed that the ex has no rights until it has been established. He must file a Paternity action (that dumbass kept calling it a MATERNITY action).

the problem she's having is, the flaky woman from PADV keeps telling her about drug dealers that have gotten custody or unsupervised visitation with their children.



stealth2 said:
Your sister needs to get a court order specifying visitation. Period.

And if she knew how he did his other kids - what the hell was she doing having one by him? Jaysus Christ on Crutches - women can be stupid.
 

CJane

Senior Member
nikkilt28 said:
the problem she's having is, the flaky woman from PADV keeps telling her about drug dealers that have gotten custody or unsupervised visitation with their children.


Yup. In order to get court ordered supervised visitation, she's going to have to prove that he's a clear danger to the child.
 
Is the visitation for the child outlined in the Full Order of Protection (for your sister) or not? If it is outlined then that IS a court order that has to be followed.

If it is not outlined in the Court Order then your sister does not have to allow ANY visitation at all until Paternity is established and there is a Court Order outlining visitation.
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
nikkilt28 said:
the problem she's having is, the flaky woman from PADV keeps telling her about drug dealers that have gotten custody or unsupervised visitation with their children.

And they have. She has to PROVE that he's a danger to the child. Period. The fact that there is an order for visitation indicates that there has been some type of paternity determination. She's going to have to live with her choices.
 

nikkilt28

Member
proving he's a danger

that should be no problem. she had a 4 page descrption of why he's a danger to a child when they went to court for the full order of protection. Not to mention the fact, he is currently on probation for violence against anotehr individual, and he's been caught poaching while on probation. and since he did not pay those fines for the poaching tickets, it's being turned over to the PA.
Not to mention that his mentally challenged aunt has told many caretakers that he has molested her, and he thinks it should be illegal for a man to change a baby girl's diaper, "cuz it feels wrong". The GAL hated him on site at the hearing for the full order of protection, and was against him having any visits then.
He has not paid child support since the court date, and the PADV office has documented all his visits, so they can verify that he has had an opporunity to see his child for 4.5 hours a week, and has taken 2 hours every other week or every 3 weeks.
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
Again - all of this was news to her when she slept with him. Right? :rolleyes: Accident or not. Nothing is 100%, so she was still considering him as okay as a father to her child. Good choices she makes.
 

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