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Lowering amount of CS agreed to in a MSA in Florida

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CMSC

Senior Member
BLCM said:
However, if a CP is jobless.... why don't the courts impute THEM an income too? Only fair, right?




Not sure about anyone elses case, but in my case my income was imputed because I am a SAHM. They imputed it at minimum wage although in the end the judge deviated from that and just awarded what he felt was "fair".
 


L

Lil Miss Smarty Panties

Guest
ryry's mom said:
WV? Great now I am racking my brain trying to figure out who WV is. :confused:

*HINT*

Almost heaven, West Virginia
Blue Ridge Mountains
Shenandoah River -
Life is old there
Older than the trees
Younger than the mountains
Growin’ like a breeze

Country Roads, take me home
To the place I belong
West Virginia, mountain momma
Take me home, country roads


<I forget you are only in your 20's.>
 
E

Elease

Guest
I think you all have confused the law with emotion. I did not blast the OP. You have not seen blasting if you think that was blasting! Still no one has commented on the OP feeling he should not have to pay so much because the childs stepparent family is well off.

In answer to the CS guidelines, income of both parents, of GA and IL, please refer to:
Georgia Code Ann. 19-6-5
750 I.L. C.S. 5/505 et seq.
These codes also respond to imputed income for unemployed NCP's and also addresses the issues of exactly what is considered "income".

The poster was speaking in regard to the state of Florida. My responses to the OP have addressed the CS laws of the state of Florida. For each client my company gives assistance to, we research carefully the laws of their state. Of course there is a Federal Child Support guideline in which each state is required to follow.

Those of you who live to make personal attacks on this board are offering nothing to the general public who are interested in gaining insight into their personal problems. None of your emotional boo ha has provided intelligent information.

Thank you for the statistics. I am impressed with your ability to search the Internet. However, when you have walked a mile in my shoes, have seen CP who cannot afford to buy shoes for their children, much less pay rent, medical, etc., then I would like to hear your viewpoints on deadbeat parents.

My comments have been nongender in reference to "deadbeats". I have dealt with both mothers and fathers in need of support for their minor children.

Statistically speaking, my company has been in business for 15 years. We have processed the documentation for over 900 divorces alone, in every state in the country, successfully. We have received awards from our local courts for the excellent services we provide our home community. I am very proud of our ability to offer affordable assistance in legal document preparation to those who cannot pay high attorney fees. In conclusion, if you do not agree with my opinions on this board, that is your choice and because of the laws of this great country, it is your right. But rest assured, it doesn't make or break my day.
 
L

Lil Miss Smarty Panties

Guest
Elease said:
I Still no one has commented on the OP feeling he should not have to pay so much because the childs stepparent family is well off.

You should really shed your biases before posting your "advice". The original poster never said any such thing.
 
T

theother

Guest
Elease said:
"I think you all have confused the law with emotion. "

"However, when you have walked a mile in my shoes, have seen CP who cannot afford to buy shoes for their children, much less pay rent, medical, etc., then I would like to hear your viewpoints on deadbeat parents. "

**I think that YOU are the one confusing law with emotion. Your comments are obviously biased by all those children without shoes. Sure those stories are sad, but what does that have to do with the original poster?**


"Those of you who live to make personal attacks on this board are offering nothing to the general public who are interested in gaining insight into their personal problems. None of your emotional boo ha has provided intelligent information."

**Okay, why don't you show me where the legal advice is in this post, because it just sounds like a personal attack that you pulled out of you @ss to me. "Let me get this straight you want to go from paying $62.50 a week to "help" support your child to paying $37.50 a week because the step father & family is well off. Did the step father or his family have anything to do with the conseption of this child? Do they have any obligation to care for this child or to support this child? I think not. Ok...why dont you consider relinquishing parental rights and you wouldnt have to pay anything!! If you are disabled why havent you petitioned the court for a modification based on a significant change in circumstances on your part? This woman was a terror during your divorce, but you trusted her to be good for her word on an issue that could well land you in jail. Just curious..how often do you see this child? Every weekend? Twice a year? I am really sorry to sound so cynical, but I am just amazed at how hard noncustodial parents work to lessen an obligation to their children, all the while trying to justify it to the world. Preschool or no preschool, do you really think you can support a child on a total of 75 bucks a week...which is $37.50 from each parent? How long has it been since you were in the home with this child buying food, clothing, medical insurance, toys, making copays on noninsured medicines, Dr. visits..etc. 75 Bucks a week..wow that kid is really in the gravy. What a life ahead of this poor child with mommy and daddy working hard against each other." Yeah, that was wonderfully intelligent information that you gave him. :rolleyes: **


"Statistically speaking, my company has been in business for 15 years. We have processed the documentation for over 900 divorces alone, in every state in the country, successfully. We have received awards from our local courts for the excellent services we provide our home community. I am very proud of our ability to offer affordable assistance in legal document preparation to those who cannot pay high attorney fees."

**What does all this have to do with the price of tea in China? What do you want a medal or something?**
 
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jbudden

Guest
Sorry it took me so long to get back here. I was unpacking all night after MOVING to a new place with lower rent so I can try and afford my CS. Let me try and answer your questions, Elise, without sounding as bitter as you do.

1) Yes I want to lower it to $150.00 a month. She stated she needed the $250.00 a month to put her in pre-school. And yes you can raise a child on $75.00 a week. If you take away pre-school, my ex and I did it for less than that while we were married for nearly 3 years. And my EX is the one who originally said she could do fine on $250.00 a month, pre-school INCLUDED. It's very simple what I am asking for. She said she needed $250.00 a month because of pre-school. It is no longer a factor now and I am seeking to have it reduced to reflect that. What part of that is so hard for you to understand.

2) I see my daughter on every other weekend and for 2 weeks in the summer. I was lucky I got that because my ex (in playing dirty with the courts) tried to say I couldn't care for my daughter because of my disability.

3) It's been a little over a year since the divorce was finalized. They moved out about 6 months prior.

Now if you don't mind you can stop condeming me. People like you are probably the reason why there are deadbeat dads. Dads that are tired of getting trampled on in the legal system by judges and people like you who are extremely biased towards the mother.

The single, solitary reason I don't see my daughter more is because my ex will not allow it. She tried saying I needed to have supervision with me at all times to see my daughter WITHOUT JUSTIFICATION! I never beat my daughter and I most certainly did not beat her. The only reason my ex (the woman whom you think is so much better than me) left was because I became disabled and times were gonna get rough. How else would you explain handing me divorce papers on the same day I find out I'll be disabled for the rest of my life?
 
J

jbudden

Guest
Oh, and in regard to my #2 answer, it made her look pretty dumb because when we were married and I was injured, she left our daughter with me all the time when she was at work.
 

Whyte Noise

Senior Member
Elease said:
I think you all have confused the law with emotion. I did not blast the OP. You have not seen blasting if you think that was blasting! Still no one has commented on the OP feeling he should not have to pay so much because the childs stepparent family is well off.

In answer to the CS guidelines, income of both parents, of GA and IL, please refer to:
Georgia Code Ann. 19-6-5
750 I.L. C.S. 5/505 et seq.
These codes also respond to imputed income for unemployed NCP's and also addresses the issues of exactly what is considered "income".

The poster was speaking in regard to the state of Florida. My responses to the OP have addressed the CS laws of the state of Florida. For each client my company gives assistance to, we research carefully the laws of their state. Of course there is a Federal Child Support guideline in which each state is required to follow.

Those of you who live to make personal attacks on this board are offering nothing to the general public who are interested in gaining insight into their personal problems. None of your emotional boo ha has provided intelligent information.

Thank you for the statistics. I am impressed with your ability to search the Internet.

Thank you for the statistics. I am impressed with your ability to search the Internet. However, when you have walked a mile in my shoes, have seen CP who cannot afford to buy shoes for their children, much less pay rent, medical, etc., then I would like to hear your viewpoints on deadbeat parents.

My comments have been nongender in reference to "deadbeats". I have dealt with both mothers and fathers in need of support for their minor children.

Statistically speaking, my company has been in business for 15 years. We have processed the documentation for over 900 divorces alone, in every state in the country, successfully. We have received awards from our local courts for the excellent services we provide our home community. I am very proud of our ability to offer affordable assistance in legal document preparation to those who cannot pay high attorney fees. In conclusion, if you do not agree with my opinions on this board, that is your choice and because of the laws of this great country, it is your right. But rest assured, it doesn't make or break my day.

**** Elease, let me give you a little education in Georgia law, OK? My case is in Georgia, and I pay CS based on the Georgia guidelines. I can quote you word for word any section of Title 19. The section you refer to, 19-6-5 is Georgia's ALIMONY statute. I'm assuming you meant 19-6-15 which is Georgia's CS guideline statute. I'm also guessing that you're referring to the 18 or so "special circumstances" that a Georgia judge "may" take into consideration when calculating child support. (I'm also assuming that as a paralegal, you understand the difference between the words "may" and "shall" in statutory language.) A CP's income is NOT taken into consideration in Georgia. Period. It's based on a percentage of the obligors gross income. That's it. And please, show me in the following statutes where it says that the obligees income is taken into consideration.

"(1) Computation of child support shall be based upon gross income;

(2) For the purpose of determining the obligor´s child support obligation, gross income shall include 100 percent of wage and salary income and other compensation for personal services, interest, dividends, net rental income, self-employment income, and all other income, except need-based public assistance;

(3) The earning capacity of an asset of a party available for child support may be used in determining gross income. The reasonable earning potential of an asset may be determined by multiplying its equity by a reasonable rate of interest. The amount generated by that calculation should be added to the obligor´s gross monthly income;

(4) Allowable expenses deducted to calculate self-employment income that personally benefit the obligor, or economic in-kind benefits received by an employed obligor, may be included in calculating the obligor´s gross monthly income; and" then it goes on to list the percentages.

Also, the earning capacity of an obligors ASSET may be taken into consideration. Such as rental income, etc. And, if you'll notice #2, the last sentance... "Except need-based public assistance" which is TANF etc. is specifically excluded.

You didn't base your responses to the OP based on Florida laws, you made responses based on your bias against NCP's in general. Did you mention anything at all about HOW, according to Florida law, he would go about seeking a modification based on a change of circumstances because of the lack of pre-school expenses? No, you did not. Your first sentance of your reply was, and I quote, "Let me get this straight you want to go from paying $62.50 a week to "help" support your child to paying $37.50 a week because the step father & family is well off." Not blasting the poster? Think again.

Your comments on this thread has offered the poster not one iota of an idea of what to do. All you've done is state how sorry NCP's are, blah blah blah. Accusing the man of wanting to reduce his CS because his ex's husband is well of. NO, he wants to reduce it because an expense that was calculated into the original amount is NO LONGER THERE, and should NO LONGER be used in any calculations. Why can't you get that through your thick skull?

As for this comment, "However, when you have walked a mile in my shoes, have seen CP who cannot afford to buy shoes for their children, much less pay rent, medical, etc., then I would like to hear your viewpoints on deadbeat parents.".... when you have walked a mile in MY shoes, and see your SO with a child support amount set so high he has $50 a week left out of his paycheck for working 40 a week to live on, then YOU can talk to me about deadbeat parents. When you have walked a mile in my shoes and have seen a CP whine that $838 a month in CS isn't enough to buy clothes for the kids, yet goes out an purchases a new vehicle every year, a new computer, purchases things online every week that comes around, and takes their children's birthday money sent to them in birthday cards to spend on themselves, THEN you can give me your opinion on deadbeat CP's. Until that time though, you can give posters advice on the questions they asked and keep your personal biases out of your responses. They could care less about your experiences. They want to know what to do in THEIR situations.
 
E

Elease

Guest
"Her and her fiancee are not hurting for money. They just bought a brand new Saturn VUE SUV. Her fiancee's family owns a big auto salvage yard so they are all well off."

The OP did make the above statement in comparing his hard times with the CP's financial standing. What possible reason could he have for bringing this up when needing information on a CS modification!?

In Florida Judges are NOT comfortable with deviation from the Child Support Guidelines. They are allowed with a 5% margin when requested on the proper forms, sometimes. Judges do, of course, have the authority to adjust CS as they deem fit, but it is very rare, in my experience.

Thank you, but I do not need any medals. The awards received on behalf of my company and the praise of my community has been most appreciated and quite sufficient.

In Florida, CS is based on the "needs" of the child. Not what the CP thinks they need. Granted the judge has authority, again I say this, to alter the amount. But it most definitely must be for extreme circumstances.

BLCM, I do not know what state you are in. However, in Florida, with the "guidelines", it is impossible for a NCP to be left with $50.00 to live off of for a week. That is the purpose of the guidelines. And when a judge rules the affected party ALWAYS has the opportunity to appeal in these issues.

ryry's mom...in the state of FLORIDA, the CP's income is also imputed, should they be unemployed. Happens every single day.

OP, perhaps since you became disabled your wife is not comfortable with you having the child unsupervised. You do not state the nature of your disability, and it is not necessary, however it could be that she is concerned with your ability to care for the child alone. Since we have no further information on that, it is a fair assumption.

Momma Tiger please provide the states where only the income of the NCP is calculated to arrive at the amount of support necessary for the needs of the child. I am unaware of those statutes and would very much like to be informed.

Georgia has a guidelines worksheet. The income of both the CP and the NCP are used for computation. Yes and I did miss the 1 before the 5 ..thank you for pointing that out. I have made a notation to that effect. To return the favor..."sentance" is spelled sentence.

"They could care less about your experiences."
Or perhaps yours? Talk about bitter..wow...
"when you have walked a mile in MY shoes, and see your SO with a child support amount set so high he has $50 a week left out of his paycheck for working 40 a week to live on, then YOU can talk to me about deadbeat parents. When you have walked a mile in my shoes and have seen a CP whine that $838 a month in CS isn't enough to buy clothes for the kids, yet goes out an purchases a new vehicle every year, a new computer, purchases things online every week that comes around, and takes their children's birthday money sent to them in birthday cards to spend on themselves,"



TO the OP: Go to your local courthouse, where your divorce was granted. Ask the clerk in Domestic Relations for a form to modify child support. (Most Florida clerks hand out all the forms you could ever need to prepare your own documents, but there may be one or two out there who won't) Read the form, attach any supporting documentation. (Dr.s statement regarding your disability, stubs from income you receive, a family law financial affidavit, proof, in a word, any proof you have of your situation.) Fill it out. Return it to the clerk. Serve (by the sheriff) your ex with a copy of the stamped, dated form and copies of all supporting documentation. After 20 days, call the clerk and ask if a hearing has been set. A mediation hearing will likely be set first and the two of you can appear before a mediator to try to come to a conclusion. If you do not come to a conclusion you may go before a General Master for a hearing. When a hearing has been set, be there. State your case. Or hire a paralegal or an attorney to do it all for you, except the appearance of course, you will want to be there with an attorney should you hire one. Strickly your choice. As far as your visitation goes..if you are not getting your visitation you may petition the court as well for a Motion of Contempt or an Order To Show Cause. Its that simple.
 
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libby b

Guest
I am so glad that y'all are standing behind the poster, and not this woman who thinks that she is GOD. I have a 20 month old daughter who is disabled, and my husband busts his butt (working anywhere from 50-80 hours a week) in order to pay his child support on his three other children that he doesn't have custody of. The cs wasn't really a major issue while I was working, but since our daughter's birth, I have had to stay at home with her (not complaining, I will take the never having money to be with her over and over again if given the choice)

El.. whatever her name is, has been sitting her blasting NCP without regard to anything other than her opinion. Don't know if you realized this yet or not, but NO TWO PEOPLE WILL HAVE THE SAME SITUATION!

We just had my ss for over a month, we couldn't afford to pay the phone bill, yet we still paid cs for ss (even though we had him, and that is NOT part of the cs) we still provided him with new shoes, clothes, etc. not to mention the fact that he is almost 4 and wasn't potty trained bc the CP didn't feel the need to take the time to help him. I'm happy to say that his STEPMOTHER and FATHER took the time, and now he IS potty trained.

My husband was just laid off, and now the CP is already trying to put my husband in jail. She didn't want her son when she was getting the child support, even though she wasn't supposed to bc we had him, but when she found out my husband lost his job, she wanted him back so that she could file papers against him for cs. Even told me that was her plan.

JMO, but I think people need to back off about people being deadbeats, and look at the individual situation.
 
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libby b

Guest
Another thing to clue you in...

I guess you only need to know laws in your state for your precious job, but my husband was bringing home $20 a week for a family of 3, and the judge told him to go get another job because if he was having this much trouble paying his ordered cs, he had no business having another baby.

And before you say the judge was right, I was working full time and planned to continue until my daughter was born with brain damage, and she has every right to be here, and neither of us regret her.
 

stealth2

Under the Radar Member
"OP, perhaps since you became disabled your wife is not comfortable with you having the child unsupervised. You do not state the nature of your disability, and it is not necessary, however it could be that she is concerned with your ability to care for the child alone. Since we have no further information on that, it is a fair assumption."

Leesie - did you miss the part where OP stated that CP had no problem with his being the caregiver while he was diasbled and prior to her filing?

The rest - yeah, I'll get you that info tomorrow sometime. I'm not in a mood to go digging it up now.
 

Whyte Noise

Senior Member
Well then Elease, perhaps you should go and tell the judge in Georgia that figured my CS amount how he messed up because he didn't count my ex's income. Or, perhaps I should just fax you my final decree, which has the computations in it, and you can see for yourself that Georgia does not, in fact, include the CP's income in their CS calculations. Or, maybe you can call a state legislator and tell them the language in the guidelines and the way they compute CS is wrong. Take your pick. Better yet, here is what my decree says, verbatim:

"In determining child support, the court finds as follows:

1.) The gross income of the obligor is $XXXX.XX per month

2.) In this case, child support is being determined for three (3) children.

3.) The applicable percentage of gross income to be considered is:

Number of children: 3
Percentage Range of Gross Income: 25 to 32 percent

4.) Thus, 25% of $XXXX.XX (gross income of obligor) equals $XXX.XX per month, per child, or $XXX.XX per month."

Now, please show me where they included my ex's income in any of that? Or, do you still want to insist that Georgia goes by a shared income model?

The OP made a statement. Thatw as it. He didn't say that he wanted to reduce his CS because of that. It was nothing more than a statement.

My SO's order is in Missouri. And if you think it's impossible to be left with $50 a week to live off of, then plsae tell that to my bank account.

Again, my comment about my own situation wsa directed to you, and not the OP. You wanted to start the "cry me a river" charade, and I responded to you. I don't let my feelings about my own ex, nor my SO's ex affect any response I give on this board. As it should be. Perhaps you could benefit from practicing the same. Bitter about the situation? Yeah, I am. When a CP does some of the things my SO's ex has done, including taking a child's birthday money and using it for her own purposes, then that does piss me off. It would anybody. But again, that makes no difference to the posters on here looking for answers to their own situations, so I don't bring that into my answers.
 
L

Lil Miss Smarty Panties

Guest
Tennessee is another state that only uses the obligors income.
 
E

Elease

Guest
Libby B and Momma Tiger.. you can scroll down and look to the left to get the correct name of a poster in which you are trying to respond. Of all the posts to this poor, poor NCP's original question, I notice I am the only one who provided complete, detail instructions on how to file his own child support modification. Wonder why.

Another tip to the OP. I do not know what circuit you are in, but you can go to www.ninja9.org and print out the forms you need from there, which is easier than a trip to the clerks office. These forms on the Ninth Judicial Circuit are Supreme Court approved forms and can be used in any jurisdiction in the state of FLORIDA. Be sure you have Adobe Acrobat, if you do not, you can download the reader free from this site as well to enable you to print the forms and fill them out either by hand or on a typewritter. If you do not understand the forms, do not ask the clerk for assistance, they will not give it. You must consult a legal professional. Once you have completed them Intake at the courthouse will assist you with filing, but will not give legal advice.
 

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